Railroading Rifqa: Ohio Stripping Rifqa of Her Rights

hat tip illustration IOTW

In covering the gross violation of Rifqa Bary's civil rights and human rights, I asked John Jay to assist in tracking down leads and navigating through the legal maze. John Jay is infinitely qualified to weigh in on Rifqa, as he for practiced law for ten years in the juvenile courts of Washington, prosecuting, defending, and also actively working in the dependency courts, representing the interests of dependent juveniles in all kinds of proceedings.

I think it's criminal that Rifqa does not pick her own attorney. I think it's criminal that the same statists  who are enforcing sharia, the same statists who will send Christian convert Rifqa Bary back to the fundamentalist Islamic home, the same statists who are putting her life in jeopardy, are the same statists who are picking her lawyer. This is like a friggin third world country. The kid is getting railroaded.
And John thinks it is absolutely criminal for Rifqa's attorney (who is unfamiliar with sharia law and apostasy, the very crux of the case) to be forced to go to trial without adequate time to prepare.

What follows are John's observations and an eye opening email exchange with Eric Fenner, executive director of Franklin County Children Services, who told the Columbus Dispatch, that he has no reason to believe Rifqa wouldn't be safe with her parents, and then did not recall those same remarks not one day later.

John Jay wrote me the following,

"Ohio’s courts appear to jeopardize Rifqa Bary’s safety and well being, indeed, her life, by engaging in a rush to judgment in here dependency case, not at all in keeping with the factual and legal complexity of the case, and not at all consonant with her rights to due process and a fair hearing. she is simply being denied the time she needs to mount a case showing why her life is in danger: this seems a burden unduly and unfairly imposed upon her by a court system which has made up its mind, and which rushes to judgment. the fairness of any hearing in ohio is compromised by the undue haste with which the matter has apparently been brought to trial, less than a week from the time the case was transferred from Florida on jurisdictional grounds.

The court in Florida made no rulings on the merits of her dependency, ruling only that because no case was being heard in her home state of ohio that the Florida courts could entertain the matter on the basis of an emergency jurisdiction, and while the issue of ultimate jurisdiction was being decided that she be held in the custody and protection of Florida child services.

When her parents filed a dependency action in ohio, the Florida court ceded jurisdiction to the Ohio courts and she was transferred there for hearing on the merits of her case, stemming from her flight from her parent’s home, upon what she has related were threats of physical harm and death.

She has been back in Ohio less than two weeks, and trial on the merits of the case has apparently been convened, and is scheduled to begin again on November 16, 2009 after a continuance. my friends, I practiced law for 25 years, and this procedural hiatus until the 16th does not give her lawyer time in which to adequately review the voluminous materials, including police reports, the report from the florida child protective authorities (the fdle), and the various other matters to be considered, such as reports from the Ohio authorities, let alone time to prepare for trial and subpoena those witnesses and authorities necessary to present rifqa’s case.

Rifqa Bary has asserted that her life is in mortal danger because she is an apostate from islam, i.e., a muslim who has renounced her faith and who has chosen Christianity as her spiritual path.

This is a necessary part of her presentation before the court, to show why she is in danger if returned home, and to show the motivation behind her father’s threat of death to her, for being apostate. these threats, are part and parcel of the pathology behind and leading to the “honor killings,” the likes of which you have read about in this blog.

Yet, she has not been given the time necessary to educate her lawyer in the reality of this, let along given time for her lawyer to get up to speed on what honor killings are all about, let along given time for her lawyer to get a hold of the witnesses and authorities who can explain this phenomena to the courts.

The following is an exchange of letters between Jihn Jay  and Eric Fenner, who is administrator of the Franklin county [Ohio] children's services, and it highlights the cavalier and superficial approach being given to the Bary case in Ohio. Need it be said, but this is a matter of life and death to Rifqa Bary, and, apparently, “just business” to the Ohio authorities, who give the protection of this girl very, very short shrift.

re: the rifqa bary caseþ
From: John Jay _________
Sent: Wed 10/28/09 11:19 AM
To: edfenner@fccs.co.franklin.oh.us
re: rifqa bary

my very dear sir:

i practiced law in the state of washington, in yakima county for the most part, nearly 25 years, recently taking inactive status due to health reasons. my bar number in the state of washington was #12689, i have no idea whether it has been "recycled" or not.

for nearly ten years i practiced in our juvenile courts of yakima county, prosecuting, defending, and also actively working in the dependency courts, representing the interests of dependent juveniles in all kinds of proceedings.

i have, therefore, very extensive experience in dependency work ranging from routine shelter care hearings to full blown trials on termination of parental right, and with all the things that go on in between, such as custodial and protective placement of juveniles, and parental visitation and the like. i will not bore you with the details of procedures and practices with which i trust you are very familiar.

in the news accounts that i have read of this case, and after reading the florida fdle investigative interview with rifqa bary, it would seem to me that she has raised a very colorable accusation of threats to do harm by her father, which incident these threats she alleges to have occurred have been at least partially corroborated by the confirmation of the parents. and, it may interest you to know, that a brother, disseminated information of her whereabouts in florida while under the protective custody of the florida juvenile services people, onto websites frequented by muslims who threatened her harm.

i have also read news accounts in which you are attributed the statement/sentiment that you find no credible evidence that she is under any risk of harm from her parents, or from muslims who attend the noor mosque.

sir, in my 25 y ears in court, the statement of a juvenile that a parent has threatened her with harm or death, is very much indeed, "credible" evidence. and, i would find it incredible were you not aware of that fact.

there is error and mistake in this world. plenty of it.

in my entire history as a lawyer, when courts are faced with a quandary, they choose to side on prudent conduct, even if they know it might be mistake. i cannot tell you how often i have heard a judge, or a guardian ad litem, or a lawyer advocate in court that if we are to make error, as least let us make error on the side of prudence.

this child has alleged that her father threatened to kill her, and brandished a lap top computer at her when he uttered the threat, and threatened to destroy the computer to keep her from contacting persons outside her family, and outside her religion. he also threatened to take her back to sri lanka. the father has confirmed the incident with the computer, though he denies the death threat. the mother confirms that the family threatened to return to sri lanka, to continue her schooling. (i will remind you, that she receives straight "a's" in your fine ohio schools, hardly consistent with a "delinquent child" in my experience in dependency and truancy courts. is it yours?)

so, we have an incident in which a child relates being recipient of a death threat.

we have confirmation that the incident/encounter took place, from the accounts of her parents.

sir, this hardly seems to me a situation/case/matter in which "no credible evidence" of a risk to harm exists to a child.

your courts and your juvenile service, sir, are charged with protecting the welfare of that child. that is also your personal charge. i would expect you to exercise that charge with prudence, and a diligent search for the truth of the matter, as well as with the utmost effort to provide care and protectio n to a juvenile under your charge. anything less from you would be dereliction of your duty, would it not? would you not tend to agree with me on that last pronouncement? as i conceive the matter, it is your duty to exercise your legal charge in such a manner as to not compromise the safety of this child, rifqa bary, who has been placed in your care.

i understand that the statutory charge governing dependency proceedings is the re-unification of the family. but, within that charge, lie greater duties of care to provide care and protection to the subject juvenile while the dependency proceedings go along.

i cannot conceive, in my wildest dreams, that a juvenile would be peremptorily returned to a family in which the encounter described by rifqa bary has been confirmed by the parents, and in which she alleges that she has been faced with death threats, and has been subject to continual physical and psychological abuse.

i must admit, of course, that i never practiced dependency law in the state of ohio, nor before your courts in franklin county. perhaps the standards in your court, and in your protective service, as somewhat less than those standards administered in the courts before which i practiced, and very much less than the standards followed by the child protective services personnel with whom i worked. they [under]took the protection of juveniles, and their lives, which is, after all, dear sir, just exactly what we have at stake here.

and, of course, i never worked with a juvenile services administrator who was of a habit on issuing statements on the merits of cases pending in the courts, and who would say that no credible evidence of abuse exists in a case where a child has related being the recipient of a death threat.

usually, in my experience at least, cases are tried in court upon the admission of material and relevant evidence, (which sworn testimony most assuredly is), and not upon the newspaper prono uncement of service administrators who may or may not have the full command of the evidence to be presented in court. have you, sir, that you can make the statement attributed to you?

in good conscience, can you answer that in the affirmative?

i expect you to do your job. to your fullest extent, and with your best efforts. i expect you to carry out your charge of protecting this child. you have an ethical, moral and legal obligation to do so. nothing less.

john jospeh jay 136 s.e. 8th avenue milton freewater, oregon 97862 phone: ___.___.____.

more, along the same line, inquiring of mr. fenner whether or not he had bothered to notice that rifqa has suffered serious injury to her eye:

p.s. mr. fenner. have you noticed rifqa bary's right eye? have you any idea in the world, how it was injured? or, is that the sort of thing that interests the child protective services in the state of ohio.

she will be appointed counsel, and a guardian ad litem, and evidence will be taken and considered, will it not? or, does your opinion as expressed in the papers simply carry the day?

shortly after, i sent mr. fenner another inquiry:

re: rifqa baryþ
From: John Jay
Sent: Wed 10/28/09 12:09 PM
To: ed fenner (edfenner@fccs.co.franklin.oh.us)

dear mr. fenner:

it slipped my attention, but in previous emails i forgot to ask if you might have any bureaucratic supervisors with whom you have conversation about the duties of your position, and your purview to make public comment on cases which have yet to be decided upon their merits by a court of competent jurisdiction.

in my state[s], for instance, counties are political sub-divisions of the state, and i thought that situation might obtain as well in ohio. i would be curious, therefore, which department in the state of ohio, or perhaps the governor's office in ohio, might have direct supervision over your conduct.

would you be so kind as to respond to me with this information.

john joseph jay
milton freewater, oregon usa

this last inquiry finally prompted a response from mr. fenner, and i print it here in its entirety:

RE: rifqa baryþ

From: Fenner, Eric D (edfenner@fccs.co.franklin.oh.us)
Sent: Wed 10/28/09 12:29 PM

RE: rifqa baryþ

To: John Jay

I report to a Board of Trustees that are appointed by a Board of County Commissioners, but just for clarification, exactly what public comments are you referring?

Eric

i have underlined a portion of mr. fenner’s response, which though not totally unresponsive to the concerns addressed in my emails, did respond by saying who his supervisors are. but, as evidenced by the underlined portion of his email, his concerns seem rather to focus more on just what has been attributed to him as a speaking agent for franklin county, ohio’s juvenile court. keep in mind, as will be very evident in just a bit, that mr. fenner is not just fellow pulled in off the street, but he is in fact, the executive director of franklin county [ohio] children’s services, and as such, he is in charge of those who would be investigating the circumstances of this case, and in charge of those submitting reports to the court on the facts of the home life, and, based on this, making recommendations to the court upon the merits of the court’s decision.

and, as you will see below, he did not wait to “hear the rest of the story.”

i sent additional inquiries to mr. fenner along this line:

RE: rifqa baryþ

From: John Jay
Sent: Wed 10/28/09 12:51 PM
To: ed fenner (edfenner@fccs.co.franklin.oh.us)

eric:

excuse me for not having the native wit to inquire in my last post, but did you or did you not make such remarks, or similar remarks, to the media regarding rifqa bary being at no apparent risk in being sent back to her parents?

i am curious about this.

john jay

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: john jay

Subject: RE: rifqa bary
Date: Wed, 28 Oct 2009 12:44:23 -0700

finally, having received no further response from mr. fenner, i sent him the following email, which also has not been responded to.

mr. fenner, i am assuming, knows full well what he has said to the columbus dispatch, but he does not seem to want to own up to it now, because it is indicative that the ohio authorities have very grossly pre-decided this case, and that rifqa bary is being subject to a kangaroo court in the state of ohio. “let’s give him a fair trial for murder, and then hang the son of a bitch on thursday,” as the old joke goes. said mr. fenner:

From: John Jay
Sent: Wed 10/28/09 1:45 PM 
To:ed fenner (edfenner@fccs.co.franklin.oh.us)

eric:

these are the remarks attributed to you in the columbus dispatch. Runaway teen to return to Ohio -- but when? Runaway teen to return to Ohio -- but when? Columbus Dispatch

Eric Fenner, executive director of Franklin County Children Services, would not comment because of a gag order. He has said he has no reason to believe Rifqa wouldn't be safe with her parents

do you wish to confirm or deny them? john jay

p.s. i am given to understand that trial on the merits has begun on this matter, and is to re-convene on november 16, 2009. this seems to me, in my experience, an extraordinarily fast setting for trial in a matter of this complexity. the florida fdle report alone comprises many pages of discovery, and these allegations are complex. is counsel able to digest all of this in such a short time, ... , is counsel experienced enough to recognize all of the issues raised in this matter, including the issue of the danger raised to rifqa bary by the fact that she is apostate?

seems to me that the state of ohio, you as adminstrator and the magistrate as a judge, are under just as much under scrutiny here as the merits of this case. this seems to me an awful rush to judgment, and it does not reflect very well upon you or the court, in my humble opinion.

the people i worked with in juvenile court services, and in the child protective services, department of social and health services, state of washington, took very seriously their charge of protecting children. ohio, it seems, may not.

one might not be able to build an airtight case based upon mr. fenner’s pre-judgment of what is, as a matter of fact and law, to be the ultimate judgment of the dependency court in the dependency case has been derelict in the performance of his duties, but one sure as hell could build an air tight case that mr. fenner has been precipitous in issuing such a pre-judgment prior to the reports and investigations to be done by his department, and submitted to the court for its decision.

it is not mr. fenner’s job to be issuing and making such decisions upon the merits of a case pending before the juvenile court. it is not, simply put, within his purview to be shooting off his mouth in public on such matters, and it clouds the judgment of any jurist expecting a report and analysis upon such matters from mr. fenner’s department.

and, if this is the general attitude of the ohio authorities, then what we have is a cowardly sheriff ready to turn over the prisoner to the lynch mob, so that they can get on with the job of “… hanging the guilty bastard right now!!”

it is not, in my judgment, the franklin county [ohio] children’s services department’s finest hour.

i was concerned by this exchange, with a man who should have the interests of rifqa bary before all, who should be worried about protecting her, who, in fact, seems more interested in protecting his own butt about injudicious public comments he has made on a matter which indicates pre-judgment of the ultimate facts in the case, and not a desire to investigate them, … , so, I called the clerk of the franklin country juvenile court, and confirmed the following facts:

case name: fatima rifqa bary
case/docket number: 09-JU12299 (dependency court)
trial continuance setting: november 16, 2009
trial before: magistrate goodrich
counsel for bary: angela lloyd , phone: 614.292.9176
juvenile clerk's office: phone: 614.462.4411

the above is called a case or docket setting, and this information would indicate that rifqa bary’s trial has already been started, and that it is to reconvene 11.16.2009, barely 12 business days for the court from now.

i asked the clerk of the court whether a shelter care hearing would be heard, usually a preliminary hearing held in dependency cases to determine a child’s residency pending the hearing of the case on its merits: in most such situations, though not all, a child is to be placed in custodial protection separate from the parents, often after having been removed from a home by the child protective services personnel without recourse to hearing. at a shelter care hearing parents may, but do not always, request a child be sent home, and, usually, though not always a placing outside the home is ordered, often with relatives but more often with social agencies.

the clerk told me no such hearing had been heard.

i thought the setting she referred to might be a continued shelter care hearing, so that the court might benefit from the hearing of all sides of the issue, sometimes to include reports from social workers or the department of social and health services as to whether previous interventions have been made in the home on behalf of neglected or abused children.

no, said the clerk, it is a trial setting.

i said, isn’t that a rather quick setting on a case such as this, it is pretty complicated.

she said, well, it is high profile. she also said that she has been getting a lot of phone calls on this case. and, that is was odd, because it wasn’t coming up under rifqa bary, the name that i had given her. oh, that’s right, she said, i remember, it is fatima bary.

this is absolutely extraordinary, that a matter of this complexity, factually and legally, would be set for trial this quickly. it is incredible, in my experience. it calls into question to me whether rifqa has a lawyer who may not be experienced enough to know how to prepare a case like this for trial, as no experienced lawyer would want to take a matter to trial of such complexity, so quickly.

and, what it suggests most strongly, is that a central issue of the case, the fear that rifqa has because she is apostate from islam, simply will not get heard in a complete and competent exposition by rifqa’s lawyer. the fact is, it is going to take rifaq some time to explain the facts of the case, and the family background, leading up to her leaving home. it is going to take some time for any lawyer to absorb the rather complicated issue of apostasy, and to understand the dire threat that apostasy poses to rifqa bary, and that the threat of harm to her comes most immediately from her own family, and from those persons who know her best at her own mosque. it is going to take some time for the lawyer to absorb the fact that rifqa’s own brother poses a grave danger to her, and would be a likely accomplice in her death, were she to be killed in an honor killing. and, finally, were rifqa’s lawyer to comprehend all of that, she will need to contact witnesses who can support rifqa’s version of the events, and she will need to contact expert witnesses competent to explain apostasy and honor killings to what is likely to prove an incredulous judge.

this cannot be done in 12 days.

rifqa finds herself apparently in a kangaroo court wishing to dispose of a bothersome case in the very least amount of time possible, with the very least amount of bother.

“take him out and hang the son of a bitch. oh, yes, first we have a trial, and then we hang the son of a bitch!!”

only this time, it is not a joke.

it is a tragedy. because an ohio court & judge, and an ohio bureaucrat (that would be mr. fenner) who are charged with the protection of a child, are going to sell that child down the river in their ignorance, and in their sloth, for not having the interest or the wherewithal to do their jobs, to investigate the truth of this, and to take a little girl’s word that she was threatened with death.

well, hell, you can hear mr. fenner say, we catholics don’t do stuff like that.

the fact is, mr. fenner and his ilk are simply do lazy to do the home work, and protect this little girl in the ways in which they are statutorily charged. i guess i misspoke myself earlier. on consideration, ohio and mr. fenner look entirely derelict.

john jay @ 10.28.2009

Thanks, JJ.

Remember, we must call. Every day. Show Ohio Rifqa is not alone no matter how they isolate her in solitary confinement.

Please contact Franklin County Children Services and the Ohio governor’s office at the following addresses and let them know that you want Rifqa to be able to have the basic freedoms to communicate to the outside world, and that she needs to be protected from her parents & the radical Islamic community:

Franklin County children services can be reached here.

Eric Fenner's fax number is 614-275-2755 and his e-mail address is edfenner@FCCS.co.franklin.oh.us/

The Ohio governor’s office can be reached here.

Also, Governor Strickland is up for re-election. Here is John Kasich's contact information.

Tell Kasich the election is his to win ...or lose.

CALL OR WRITE EVERY DAY

UPDATE: Choi gave me a heads up on the referendum coming before Columbus voters in November. I'd send them a message:

The 2009 Children Services Levy

A 3.10 mill replacement with reduction levy to benefit Franklin County Children Services for the purpose of protecting abused and neglected children and providing services to abused and neglected children and their families will appear as Issue 4 on the Franklin County November 3 General Election ballot.

This levy replaces a 3.15 mill levy which expires at the end of 2009 and which provides more than one-third of the agency’s operating budget. Without passage of the levy, FCCS would lose $65 million in funding.

Comments

[twitter.com/satchmoshello]

Thank you, John Jay.

[Jew_Lover]

Bless you John Jay - you may very well have saved Rifqa's life.

This letter is now public for perpetuity and should the authorities do something without due diligence, or even criminally negligent - Pamela has this on site for the whole world to see.

Rifqa - if you or your friends are reading this, please know you have several visible guardian angels: Pamela Geller, Robert Spencer, and John Jay, as well as may more concerned citizens praying for you.

[IndieJones]

John Jay,
You are magnificent.
May the Ohio authorithies get a clue and protect
Rifqa...or would they rather she end up like the
girl in Phoenix Arizona who, just 5 days ago, was run over by her Iraqi father in his jeep because "she was becoming too westernized".
Yeah... and Not ONCE did any article I read about this attempted murder have the words Muslim or attempted Honor Killing....They just pretend it doesn't exist.
Here's a link to one of the stories:
http://blogs.phoenixnewtimes.com/valleyfever/2009/10/peoria_police_looking_for_iraq.php

[ParahSalin]

While making calls, sending emails, and faxing, it may help to also direct concerns to the state senator and representative for New Albany.

State Senator
David Goodman (R)
Senate Building
1 Capitol Square, Ground Floor
Columbus, OH 43215
Phone: (614) 466-8064
Email: SD03@senate.state.oh.us
http://www.ohiosenate.gov/david-goodman.html

State Representative
Marian Harris (D)
District: 19
Term: 1st
Term Limit: Eligible to run for another two-year term
Address:
77 S. High St
12th Floor
Columbus, OH 43215-6111
Phone: (614) 466-4847
Fax: (614) 719-6958
Email: district19@ohr.state.oh.us
http://www.house.state.oh.us/index.php?option=com_displaymembers&task=detail&district=19

[Jokerman]

Thanks JJ, great work!

Pamela, can we contribute to a Rifqa Bary defense fund? Is there one?
Could we start one?

This young woman needs competent counsel!

Besides all the good ideas above, what can we do about getting her representation?

[PatriotUSA]

John Jay, THANK YOU. I live in Oregon and your name
sounds very familiar to me and I cannot recollect why,
but I am sure the reasons are good. The fact that all
your emails got only one puny answer(to this point)
states something quite profound. An answer back, even
a short one stating that your concerns would be addressed
in later correspondence, is shameful at best.

Pamela, If a fund of some sort is started for Rifqa
count me in even though I lost my job this past week,
and things are very bleak out here in central Oregon.
She needs all the help we can get.

[dented_uk]

http://www.dispatch.com/wwwexportcontent/sites/dispatch/images/feb/ARACE07_CRR1.JPG_02-07-08_C1_OU99FFM.jpg>
Eric Fenner
(chap standing)

[dented_uk]

John Jay - Thank You (from the bottom of my heart)

[dented_uk]

http://www.franklincountyohio.gov/children_services/assets/images/board/Fenner.jpg>
Executive Director - Eric Fenner

Eric Fenner grew up in inner city Washington, D.C. as the oldest of four children, where he attended Roosevelt High School. He was the first in his family to go to college, when basketball led him to a junior college in southeastern Kentucky, and then to Ohio Dominican University, where he completed his undergraduate degree in social work in 1978. Later, he earned his master's degree in public administration from Ohio University.

Eric began his career at Franklin County Children Services while in college as a part-time case aide in the Intake Department, where he was later hired full time to investigate child abuse and neglect allegations. He was promoted through the ranks of child welfare caseworker at Children Services, and then to group services coordinator, before leaving the agency after 11 years for the position of Director of Staff Development for the Franklin County Department of Human Services. Eric was promoted to Deputy Director at Human Services, then became Assistant Court Director of the Domestic Relations and Juvenile Branch of the Franklin County Court of Common Pleas, and later, Associate State Director of Ohio Youth Advocate Program. Eric rejoined Franklin County Children Services in 2001 as the Director of Employee Relations, earning promotions to Director of Program and Placement Services, then Deputy Executive Director by 2004. He was selected to replace retiring John Saros, as the new Executive Director of Franklin County Children Services in December of 2006, and assumed his duties on February 1, 2007.

Eric serves on numerous community boards, committees and task forces. He is married and lives in Westerville with his wife and daughter. He also has two grown sons.

http://www.franklincountyohio.gov/children_services/board/eric-fenner.cfm

[moderationist]

Fabulous job, John Jay. Why isn't Rifqa applying for emancipation?

[Jokerman]

From the Ohio State Bar:

http://www.ohiobar.org/Pages/LawYouCanUseDetail.aspx?itemID=255

"As a general rule, a child is “emancipated,” or freed from parental control, care and custody, upon reaching the age of 18 or upon graduation from high school if a child turns 18 in his or her senior year. In Ohio, emancipation also can occur before that time if the child gets married or joins the military service. While many people think that someone under 18 can go to court and “get emancipated,” Ohio law does not provide for such a court order. Rather, circumstances determine whether or not a person is emancipated in the eyes of the law."

[Jokerman]

Where Rifqa's dubious legal status here may make her ineligible to join the service, a "marriage" may be her answer.

JJ, would it be a good tactic for her attorney to force the issue of deporting her parents while she seeks asylum/amnesty or whatever?

At least that would get the parents out of the way.

But what then? A lifetime of hiding?
As the rest of you are aware, our courts, and "authorities," must be forced to uphold the principle of religious freedom and b*tch-slap islam into adhering to OUR standards and not the converse.

Keep up the pressure on our officials.
"Silence is the New Treason!"

[moderationist]

A 17 year old is not a child, they keep referring to Rifqa as a child, she is an adult in most of the world

[Optimus Maximus]

Bravo, John Jay and Atlas for keeping the pressure on these cowardly state officials.

We are all behind you in this much needed long overdue fight to prevent Sharia Law from gaining a foothold in the American legal system.

I must say, however, that I find your gratuitous slap at Catholics completely without merit, as there are millions of Catholics on your side in this fight.

While Mr. Fenner may call himself a Catholic, as you must know, there are many who claim to be Catholic that do not adhere to the teachings of the Church. Nancy Pelosi, John Kerry, and (may he rest in peace) Edward Kennedy, to name just a few.

I do not understand why you felt it necessary to denigrate your allies in this fight.

Are you channeling Maureen Dowd when you state, "well, hell, you can hear mr. fenner say, we catholics don’t do stuff like that"?

Keep up the good work, and please try a little harder to recognize your allies in this fight.

[moderationist]

The military might be preferable to getting murdered by her father and brother. It might be just the thing for her, get her away from being dependent on others, help her grow up.

[www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=771250639]

Thanks, JJ. Your knowledge and all your work is much appreciated.

I'm a little wry about your previous confidence (and that of CMax, who doesn't seem to be commenting much now) that the Ohio authorities would be careful. I'm afraid this will shake your confidence in children's services in the U.S., though perhaps only where Islam is concerned!

Friends, I want to call attention to another admission Mr. Bary made to the FDLE. In the report here

http://204.96.138.161/upload/wysiwyg/article%20pdfs/FDLE_OCR.pdf

it says:

"He stated that because she is still under age and living in his home he believed she should continue to study and practice Islam. However if she were to return from Florida, Ms. Bary would be allowed to study Christianity. Mr. Bary further stated that at the time she becomes an
adult, she would be free to worship as she pleased."

Got that? He admits that he would force her to _practice Islam_ and would permit her at most to "study" Christianity, whatever that means. In other words, he admits that he would take away her religious freedom if she were returned to him, until she was 18. (Of course, we all know he would have dragged her back to Sri Lanka before she was 18, so the promise of religious freedom then is a lie, but for now, focus on what he actually said to FDLE.) This contradicts news reports in which he said she could be whatever religion she wanted to be, that he just wants her home, etc.

I think this is worth mentioning in e-mails to Fenner and also to the ombudsman for civil rights, Cohen, as it concerns a civil rights issue--Rifqa's freedom of religion. And it is admitted right in the FDLE report, even though that report is generally slanted in favor of Mr. Bary.

[dented_uk]

Isn't he contradicting himself?

...she is still living in his home she should continue to study and practice izzlam, then if she returns from Florida she would be allowed to study Christianity....so which is it?

[www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=771250639]

I think he's saying she can _study_ both but would be forced to _practice_ only Islam until "becoming an adult."

Mind you, I think he's lying through his teeth anyway. He would just cut her off from everything to do with Christianity. Probably his idea of "studying" Christianity is being screamed at by some imam about how evil Christianity is! And his idea of "when she's an adult" is "when I decide she is an adult, and haha, we'll be in Sri Lanka by then anyway, infidel fools." And so forth.

But I still think it was quite an admission for him to make that as long as she is in his house and a minor she will definitely be forced to practice Islam. Against her conscience, obviously, since she is a Christian.

[WIde11]

Just e-mailed and snail mailed the following:

Dear Mr. Fenner;

I am 61 years old. I grew up during the 1960’s. Back then segregationists controlled most of the apparatus in a large part of the South. Challenging it meant arrest, beatings, imprisonment and sometimes death. I still remember the images of the “Freedom Riders,” men and women who rode Greyhound buses, violated the seating ordinances and were dragged off and viciously beaten by local thugs. Ending these outrages seemed like a far off dream. The system had been entrenched for over a century. But it was ended. The Klan and the bigots were driven from power despite their lies and obfuscation. In some cases their actions came back to haunt them decades later.

We have a new civil rights issue today. It is the rights of young persons and women from recent immigrant communities to choose their own lifestyles and their own beliefs free from intimidation and terror. Few have spoken up for them and I find it ironic that established groups like women’s and civil rights organizations have largely ignored the problem.

The specific issue today involves the young woman from Columbus who wishes to make her own choices regarding religious affiliation. She has provided credible evidence that her life is in danger if she is returned to her community. Sir, I have personally known people who have been killed in similar circumstances in East Africa. For many, community sanctioned murder is no imaginary threat. There have been many charges about excessive outside influence in this case. I ask only that your administration allow this girl to make up her own mind and be given the privileges accorded any American on the verge of adulthood. The issue should be her right to choose, not controlling that choice. Many young people make unwise choices and they recover from them. If, however, her fears prove valid and she is sent back to a dangerous situation there will be no second chance. She at least deserves to be kept in a secure, safe environment until age 18 and be shown the same consideration as would any child from a potentially abusive environment.

Will we continue the tradition of individual freedom that has made our society the most open and dynamic in history? Or will we acquiesce to faux and exaggerated charges of intolerance and xenophobia that hide a brutal reality? Most of us still believe there is an ultimate moral accountability in life, call it “God” or whatever. Some of us believe this will be a key decision with far reaching consequences. Please be courageous and stand for the right thing and not the convenient. Future generations will thank you.

In the tradition of the Freedom Riders,

[dented_uk]

Don't worry, the thugs of CAIR will be there to sort out any discrepancies! :(

[arius]

Muslims and the state of Ohio intend to lynch Rifqa Bary. I am not surprised by what Muslims will do, but that the state of Ohio will not protect her is very alarming. What else can this say except that Eurabia has come to the USA. We really should not be surprised by this. The dhimmization of all institutions of the USA has been building since the 1990's.

[Pamela Geller]

Thank you Wide.
Thank you, each one of you, who write.
Please don's stop.
Whatever they try to pull, let them know we are watching and they will be hed to account.

GO TO THE RALLY NOVEMBER 16 IN COLUMBUS

JOIN ME

[www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=700037977]

GEWALT, GEWALT!!!!!!!!!! Though the details of Rifqa's case are different, I think, the dimensions of this legal farce are Dreyfus-Affair-like.

[jj]

optimus maximus:

i meant no slap, backhanded or otherwise, at the catholic church.

what i was trying to portray, perhaps not very adroitly, is a recurrent problem with americans in conceptualizingthe matter of "honor" killings and the general savagery of islam.

americans, because they look at themselves as a base line reference, cannot conceive that other people in the world could believe in act in ways that are not familiar to them, that are not similar to the ways americans act and believe. it is very hard for an american to conceive that a father could be a source of danger, even death, to his daughter over the matter of her religious choice.

so they are dismissive of what we are trying to educate them in, they will not conceive it because they cannot conceive it: they insist that all people "are just like us."

i meant no disrespect to catholicism, ... , quite the opposite. no american catholic could conceive of bearing the animus to his daughter, that mr. bary bears towards rifqa bary.

i meant no insult to the catholic church, nor to any who profess the faith. if i have done so, i apologize for doing so. straightforward as that.

i meant everything i said or implied about islam. there will be no apology for that. it is barbarism unchanged and immutable since teh 7th century.

john joseph jay
milton freewater, oregon usa

p.s. and, i wish to thank everyone for their very kind and encouraging remarks. this is a wonderful post that pamela has done, and she deserves the credit for the way it was conceptualized, and laid out. she is the best. this blog is the best, head and shoulders above the rest. smiling.

[www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=700037977]

Would it be possible & make sense trying to involve Amnesty International in Rifqa's case?

[Optimus Maximus]

John Jay, you and Atlas are truly doing the Lord's work.

And I apologize to you if I misunderstood your comment regarding Catholics.

Just wanted to make sure you understood all true Catholics are 100% behind you on this very important issue.

This Islamo-crap has to be stopped before it gains anymore of a foothold in our nation.

Our political leader's blind political correctness must be challenged, and the true nature of Islam needs to be exposed for all Americans to see.

Once the majority of Americans see what Islam truly represents, and understand the second class status of women under Islamofacism, they will be united in their stand against Islam.

I can think of no one doing a better job than people such as you and Atlas in accomplishing that goal.

[dented_uk]

Our Social Services in the UK have proved on quite a few occasions to be negligent and downright lazy. Young children and babies have suffered long and drawn out painful cruelty leading to their death. Those responsible for protecting those children were held accountable. They blatantly ignored all the warning signals. The law caught up with them and they got their just desserts, they were also dragged through the mire backwards by the Media - those 'at the top' responsible, will never find another job nor will they walk down the street without being recognised.......if anything should happen to Rifqa - those at the top in Ohio should be made accountable, that includes the likes of Fenner and his cohorts.

[dented_uk]

Judith, from Amnesty International:

We support women's human rights defenders, and we are urging governments to ratify the Treaty for the Rights of Women (CEDAW) and its protocol without reservations.

In the US, we have worked in support of anti-violence legislation and other national initiatives to stop violence against women. We have worked to increase public awareness of violence against women as a global human rights issue and to contribute to efforts to challenge attitudes and behaviors that perpetuate violence against women.

Amnesty International has used a human rights framework to guide its campaigning work to stop violence against women. By using a human rights framework to oppose violence against women, we help to change the perception of violence against women from a private matter to a public concern that requires action from recognized authorities. Use of the framework also enables Amnesty International to use international human rights standards and laws to cut across national boundaries, cultures and religions to protest violence against women in all its forms. And perhaps most importantly, it makes it possible to use international remedies to hold governments accountable if they fail to meet their obligations to protect women from violence, regardless of who commits it or where it's committed.

http://www.amnestyusa.org/violence-against-women/stop-violence-against-women-svaw/page.do?id=1108417

link

[dented_uk]

oops not international, Amnesty USA

[www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=700037977]

@ Dented: Thank you for your reply! What I have meant by my question is if U.S. American supporters could ask their local AI branch to make Rifqa's case one of their Urgent Actions. Because I live in Germany I can't do it myself. But I think her American friends should do so.

[Optimus Maximus]

Also, John Jay, you are exactly correct that most Americans can not conceive of anyone treating their wives and daughters as the Muslims do.

I have experienced this myself in conversations with my mother-in-law, my wife, and sisters-in-law. They simply refuse to believe this behaviour can be considered a common tenent of Islam.

When I show them the clips Atlas sometimes posts on this site to drive the point home that it is indeed a common tenet of Islam, and it is a much more common occurence than the MSM would ever admit, they are absolutely horrified by the videos.

But, they still believe it must be a few rare deranged individuals that would do such things, instead of accepting it as a cultural norm among Muslims.

When you realize that even Fox News will not address this issue head on, and that people reading Atlas's blog, Front Page Magazine, and the other websites attempting to inform the world of the true nature of Islam are a decided minority of the news consuming public, you begin to realize the long fight we have ahead of us.

I fear it will take another 911 to get the average folks to begin to appreciate that anyone who says "Islam is a relegion of peace" is a dunderhead with no knowledge of either history or of the unchanged nature of Islam in our time.

And I believe, as was true with the Nazis, the Japanese facists, and with the Communists in the USSR, you will never change that cultural norm until you break the cycle of letting them teach these practices to their children.

We have not even attempted to tackle that issue. To the contrary, we are letting the Islamists set up their own schools in our country, and publicly funding them in some cases.

This sort of crap must be stopped, and to do so, it will take all of us to elect enough politicians with the stomach to fight Islam here in our country.

[larrysinternetsoapbox.wordpress.com]

This is why good attorneys like Mr. John Jay deserve to be paid the big bucks! He managed to in a quiet, polite and professional manner totally dress down and slap the living stupid out of Director Eric Fenner.

Tremendous job, sir.

[dms]

I was never afraid of Islam or Muslims until I started reading the Koran. Moral relativism and political correctness is going to get us all into trouble unless we get our heads out of the sand and educate ourselve on this subject before it is too late. And no, I am not currently affiliated with any religion, but my heart bleeds for this poor girl who is being sacrificed due to a vast amount of ignorance on the part of those holding authority who are supposed to know better.

[Frank Shelley]

Somoe quick comments:

John Jay, you ROCK! Your wording actually puts lawyers in a good light. I felt kinda sorry for Mr. Fenner after you were done with him. God bless you.

Wow, all this love fest on the Catholic Church - it actually has me thinking about going back (we parted ways over women's rights 30 years ago) but not being an active member does leave a void.

One or two have mentioned the military as an option, and in fact many non-citizens have used the U.S. military as a means towards citizenship (they also seem to make the best members, they KNOW how the other half lives), but you can forget about it in this case - as a 17 year old, I think Rifqa would need her parent's permission, plus one must have at least 20/100 to 20/200 vision, correctable to 20/20 to 20/30 (both limits depending on the service) - with her right eye, Rifqa will not pass a physical.

[Frank Shelley]

OOps, forgot... IS there a fund established anywhere for this young lady? I'd much rather kick in NOW, vs. donating to another Aqsa Parvez like memorial LATER.

[www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=700037977]

@ Frank: Yes, there is a trust fund for Rifqa. Info about the fund as well as further ways to support her is given at http://www.rifqabary.com/howtohelp.html.

Contribute to the trust fund:

Fathima Rifqa Bary Trust

c/o Michael A. O’Quinn, Trustee

28 West Central Boulevard, Fourth Floor

Orlando, Florida 32801

Checks or money orders should be made payable to “Fathima Rifqa Bary Trust.”

@ Pamela: My question is: Since Rifqa can't now choose her lawyer how far is the trust fund money currently of any use for her?

[www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=771250639]

Friends, here are a couple of points that it seems to me might be particularly worth emphasizing in writing to Mr. Cohen, the civil rights Ombudsman. (I'll paste in his e-mail below.) Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer and do not play one on the Internet. These just seem to me like things that would make sense to emphasize that are generally in the civil rights ballpark.

--The point of cutting Rifqa off from telephone and Internet is explicitly said by Zorn to be cutting her off from outside influences. These outside influences are all her Christian friends. This seems to introduce the issue of religious discrimination by the State of Ohio into the case. The parents want her cut off from Christian friends and Christian support so that she can be pressured to change back to Islam. By acceding to this request, the court of Ohio cooperates in an attempt to influence Rifqa's religion away from Christianity. The cut-off of communication will clearly have disparate impact on her communications with Christians vs. non-Christians. There seems to be a plausible case here that the state is violating her freedom of religion.

--Is she being allowed to meet with a Christian clergyman of her choice or other religious adviser of her choice? Even prisoners have this right as part of freedom of religion and do not have it taken away from them when in state custody.

--The quasi-criminal nature of the proceedings against her (the "incorrigible child" case) make due process especially important. The shortness of the time to the trial and Eric Fenner's extremely unwise comment to the press indicating a prejudice in the parents' favor ab initio call into question her receiving due process.

Here is the client rights ombudsman's contact info:

Kenneth Cohen
Client Rights Officer
Franklin Co. Children Services
855 Mound St.
Columbus, Ohio 43223
Phone No. 614-275-2621
E-mail address: cro@fccs.co.franklin.oh.us

Direct e-mail:

kcohen@fccs.co.franklin.oh.us

[Xavier]

Having reading todays posts along with the last couple days posts on Rifqa
I have come to the following conclusions:

1)Rifqa;s legal advisers in Florida might have been nice people but they
fumbled the ball big time . They really should have seen the move that
the parents made was possible and probable.
2)As many of us believed the only real legal protection she had was
to stay in Florida. The case was already decided in Ohio quite awhile
ago. They are now just going through the legal motions.
3)You can be sure that CAIR is behind all of this and it would appear the
new anti CAIR book out or not they are very much alive and kicking
especially in Ohio.
4)The only legal way out of this for Rifqa would be if you could shine
a huge national spot light on this trial and Rifqa's fate and keep
it there until she's safe and protected by the state or the Feds. To get
the kind of attention she will need would rquire help from some big
heavy hitters.Such as Oprah, Glenn Beck , Bill O'Reilly, Mel Gibson
the Catholic Church, Alan Dershowitz, Lou Dobbs and any other celebrity
heavy hitters you can think of. In short she going to need a huge
national outcry of support.
5)Being that I am Sicilian I must point out that when there is no justice
sometimes you must improvise. So for anyone who has contact with
Rifqa , the time for legalities is drawing near , the time for improvising
is becoming clear.

[gunjam]

Called the Ohio Governor's office today. Asked why Rifqa was denied internet access. The man who answered advised that this was decided in court, but I countered that it was not. He then basically blew me off. "Thanks for calling...." Very arrogant-sounding -- evil, in fact. Prayer is in order: Rifqa wrestles not against flesh and blood....

[WIde11]

This is near the end of a long string of comments. Don't know if this is worth mentioning or if I'm just wasting bandwidth.
But the one way she could become emancipated from her parents would appear to be through marriage. May sound bizarre or unethical but C.S. Lewis did the same for Joy Davidman to keep her from loosing her immigration status in the U.K. No requirement that the marriage be consummated (perfect grounds for later annulment). In most states women can get married without parental permission by age 17. Any talk about escape or underground railroading in this case is absurd. Too high a profile. Everyone involved would be looking at years in jail. Something like this loophole may be the only option remaining. Any men out there willing to take responsibility for this girl??
Where are all these grandstanding, high profile conservative legal foundations? Tooting their horns?
I really fear for this country if . . . .

[WIde11]

Ignore the above. Should have researched before I posted. Must be 18 in Ohio to marry w/o parental permission. Dumb idea.
GO TO THE RALLY IF YOU CAN.

[Xavier]

Strangely enough I don't think it is illegal for someone to just up and
run away. If someone was to give Rifqa some money she could just sneak
away again, As soon as you are 18 a person will not be escorted back to their
home by the state laww enforcement.

[F. Michael]

Here is the message I have sent out to every email address mentioned in this post. Friends of Rifqa Bary are welcome to plagiarize the following as they see fit:

=======================================================================

A large number of Americans have valid concerns for the continued welfare of Rifqa Bary, the young 17 year old girl that converted to Christianity from her Muslim Family and was returned to Ohio Tuesday October 27th.

As you and the governor know, this change makes Rifqa Bary an apostate in the eyes of the fundamental Muslim Community. Rifqa Bary and those who support and understand her plight have done all they can to make our authorities aware of the threats she faces.

Sadly and tragically the archaic practice of honor killings is becoming much more prevalent in America every year as an influx of Muslim immigrants are coming into our great country

I and many who have studied Islam over the years do certainly recognize that a civilized society finds it very difficult to grasp such an abhorrent practice as honor killings.

There is some standing evidence now coming to light that may put Rifqa Bary at risk.

Apparently Rifqa's Parents have fired their attorney David Colley who made a deal to get Rifqa out of the Florida Jurisdiction and now that deal is in serious jeopardy .

I implore you and the good offices of Governor Strickland to make serious and due diligence efforts on behalf of Rifqa Bary and all concerned Americans to insure that she is fully protected from any and all by the Franklin County Child Services Division and other protecting authorities.

I request that Rifqa Bary be able to have the basic freedoms to communicate to the outside world. She needs to be protected from her parents and the radical Islamic community.

Going on 45 years ago, our country took up the challenge to deal with another group that used terror to intimidate an underclass away from the exercise of rights guaranteed to them by law. Like today's Islamists, the Ku-Klux Klan also engaged in these practices in the name of their religious beliefs.

We did not tolerate this behavior by the Klan. We should not tolerate it from Muslims of any stripe either.

But there is far more at stake in this case than the fate of a beautiful 17 year old half blind Christian honor student. What is at stake is nothing less than the rule of law in our country.

Muslims in this country should take note. Right now the only thing standing between them ad a bloody pogrom against them sweeping across the North American continent is the commitment to the rule of law, OUR law, by most Americans! It is this law that permits unpopular religious minorities, such as Muslims, to worship freely and without fear. If it breaks down, there are many who will take law into their own hands. I personally do not condone this. It is an ugly truth. But it is truth nevertheless.

Let us all uphold the law which declares that young Rifqa Bary has the right to worship as she chooses. Let us not tolerate the use of terror to intimidate those who merely seek to exercise their rights. Let us reject the rule of the mob by upholding the rule of law.

Let us fulfill the promise of America to Rifqa Bary.

[F. Michael]

I may or may not be able to attend the rally. But I want to be there in spirit and in cyberspace, whether or not I can be there physically.

Perhaps it is time to do a revision of that classic civil rights song of the 1960's, "Here's to the State of Mississippi" by Phil Ochs. Use the Web link below to hear the original:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3P7UHnM9mcI

Or you can find the song and the lyrics at:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7IFbJU0VWhE&NR=1

Here is my latest draft:

HERE'S TO THE STATE OF ISLAMISM

SPOKEN: The tactics of Muslim leaders against women and girls are a direct parallel to the tactics of the Ku-Klux Klan against Blacks. Like the KKK, they are trying to intimidate their underclass from making use of their legal rights, expressly spelled out in our law. Also like the KKK, they rely on lazy or currupt government officials to let them do it.

Here's to the State of Islamism,
For Underheath her borders, the devil draws no lines,
If you drag her sandy deserts, nameless bodies you will find.
Whoa the the cover of Sharia has hid a thousand crimes,
The calender is lyin' when it reads the present time.
Whoa here's to the land you've torn out the heart of,
Islamism find yourself another country to be part of!

Here's to the people of Islamism
Who say we infidels, we blasphemy do hurl
And they tremble in their shadows at their jihad's flag unfurled
Their pious platitudes can't cleanse their image in the world
They smile and shrug their shoulders at the murder of a girl
Oh, here's to the land you've torn out the heart of
Islamism find yourself another country to be part of

Here's to the schools of Islamism
Where they're teaching all the children that they don't have to care
All of rudiments of hatred are present everywhere
And every single classroom is a factory of despair
There's nobody learning such a foreign word as fair
Oh, here's to the land you've torn out the heart of
Islamism find yourself another country to be part of

Here's to the lawyers of Islamism
They're smoking their tobacco at the open prison door
Their turbans bob above them as they knock you to the floor
No they don't like taking prisoners in their long religious war
Behind their broken pledges they are murderers and more
Oh, here's to the land you've torn out the heart of
Islamism find yourself another country to be part of

And, here's to the imams of Islamism
Who wear the robe of honor as they crawl into the court
They're guarding all the bastions with their phony legal fort
Oh, justice is a stranger when the prisoners report
When the woman stands accused the trial is always short
Oh, here's to the land you've torn out the heart of
Islamism find yourself another country to be part of

And here's to the stooges of Islamism
In the swamp of their bureaucracy they're always bogging down
And criminals are posing as the mayors of the towns
They're hoping that no one sees the sights and no one hears the sounds
And the speeches of the President are the ravings of a clown
Oh, here's to the land you've torn out the heart of
Islamism find yourself another country to be part of

And here's to the laws of Islamism
Bureaucrats will gather in a circus of delay
While the Constitution is drowning in an ocean of decay
Runaway girls should be put to death, I've even heard them say
Yes, corruption can be classic in the old Islamist way
Oh, here's to the land you've torn out the heart of
Islamism find yourself another country to be part of

And here's to the church under Islamism
Where the cross, once made of silver, now is caked with rust
And the Sunday morning sermons pander to their lust
The fallen face of Jesus is choking in the dust
Heaven only knows in which god they put their trust
Oh, here's to the land you've torn out the heart of
Islamism find yourself another country to be part of

[F. Michael]

Xavier, God bless your Sicilian heart!

If more people understood that sometimes the courts fail us and that we must improvise, Terri Schiavo might still be with us!

There have been too many martyrs. Let's keep Rifqa's corpse off that stack!