ATLAS EXCLUSIVE: FINAL REPORT ON OBAMA BIRTH CERTIFICATE FORGERY CHANGE YOU CAN BELIEVE IN

Techdude delivers a final report that exceeds my wildest expectations. It is irrefutable, empirical evidence - Obama's birth certificate is a forgery. Why? Why a COLB (certificate of live birth)  forgery? That is the question.

My deepest thanks and appreciation for Techdude's unwavering commitment to the truth despite the threats and harassment, the slashed tires and the dead animal on his porch.

Insofar as "techdude's" credentials, he is an active member of the Association of Certified Fraud Examiners, American College of Forensic Examiners, The International Society of Forensic Computer Examiners, International Information Systems Forensics Association - the list goes on. He also a board certified as a forensic computer examiner, a certificated legal investigator, and a licensed private investigator. He has been performing computer based forensic investigations since 1993 (although back then it did not even have a formal name yet) and he has performed countless investigations since then.

Here is his analysis:

Obama’s Birth Certificate – CHANGE you can believe in.

I have decided to leave out the low level technicalities and the how-to section of this report due to a lack of time and more importantly I want to get the facts out as quickly as possible. As some of you may or may not know some asshat decided to track me down and vandalize my car and hang a dead mutilated rabbit from my front door in a lame attempt to intimidate me from proceeding with releasing any details of my analysis. They did succeed in delaying the report by a few days but instead of deterring me they just really pissed me off. To their credit, if I had not taken a few days off from the analysis I would have missed the most damning piece of evidence – the remnants of the previous security border. So to the demented retard who slaughtered an animal to make a point – f*ck you and thank you. And because of the amazing number of violent psychopaths who seem to be drawn to this issue, I am not going to use or supply any details that can be used to identify the owners of the COLBS used in the analysis except for those which have already been publicly disclosed. If the owners want to come forward on their own that is entirely their decision. Now let’s get to the summarized report.

In questioned document analysis there are several methods for detecting forgeries – the most basic of which is to conduct a side by side evaluation of known good samples to compare against the questioned one and to use an alternate light source to highlight the changes in the color and density of the inks and paper. In the case at hand there are no questioned physical documents to examine so I used the same basic techniques modified for the digital age for use in computer forensic analysis.

The following analysis was conducted using various Hawaiian COLBS issued over a multi-year time frame ranging from 2001 through 2008 but this report will focus only on the results from the March 2007 through June 2008 certificates for accurately comparing against the KOS image purportedly printed by the Health Department of Hawaii in June 2007. I am only interested in comparing apples to apples as they say but I will touch on some of the other years for a brief comparative and observational analysis.

Since the image presented is a graphical image and not a physical certificate I made the concerted effort to track down known good certificates and certificates images to use for the analysis. Thanks to several individuals I managed to collect and review multiple images of certificates issued between 2001 through 2003 all of which bore an identical layout to the previous Decosta image which was issued during the same time frame. Several more certificate images and physical certificates were also sent to me of certificates issued between 2006 through 2008 directly by their respective owners.  All of the 2006 through 2008 certificates bore an identical layout to one another. Several copies of the images were created to allow digital modifications to be made without altering the original images. MD5 and SHA1 signatures were generated for each of the images and their duplicates. The signatures of the duplicates matched against their originals and the original images were then moved to a separate protected directory on the server.

By separating the certificate issue dates into groups the pre-2006 certificates show a clearly different security border design than the more recent 2006 through 2008 design. There were no other visually detectible modifications to the layout of the certificates between all time frames aside from the additional change from the DATE ACCPETED to DATE FILED headings.

 

Image 1. 2001 – 2008 border patterns

All known good certificate images from all time frames examined shared an apparent identical layout and font. Each of the available un-cropped full certificate images, from all time frames, showed the security borders to be almost perfectly centered from left to right within the lower 2/3 rd portion of the 8 ½ x 11 inch page with all deviations off center being within 15 pixels. Measurements were taken from the top left, top right, bottom left, bottom right, center top, and center bottom of each images security border to the edges of the visible paper which appeared as hard edges with the top cover of the scanners creating whitespace.

 

Image 2. Measurements

The embossed seals and ink stamps in all of the pre-2006 images are clearly visible in the scans however none of the post-2006 seals or ink stamps are visible without extensive manipulation to the digital images. Even when scanning the physical post-2006 certificate in my possession using multiple resolutions and using multiple scanners I was also unable to produce an image which would allow the seal to show though the image. The ink stamps on the rear side were also not visible in the front side scans without digital modifications to the scanned images. My scans of the physical certificate also produced the same results using multiple resolutions and using multiple scanners. 

The post-2006 COLBs were then compared against one another for a direct 1:1 comparison. Using copies of the images I digitally enhanced and modified the scans by removing only the hatch pattern background and then removing the merged information fields leaving just the raw document templates and saving them as a series of digital overlay templates. When the 2006 overlay was placed on top of the 2007 image they matched from corner to corner with some minor variations on the minute angle of the images. The fonts were observed to be in the same locations and of the same size and kerning. The procedure was then used with the 2006 overlay on top of the 2008 image. Once again, they matched from corner to corner with some minor variations on the minute angle of the images. The fonts were observed to be in the same locations and of the same size, style, and kerning. The 2007 overlay was then applied on top of the 2008 image. The 2007 and 2008 also matched from corner to corner with some minor variations on the minute angle of the images. The fonts were observed to be in the same locations and of the same size, style, and kerning. Having verified that all of the examined post-2006 certificates were identical in form and substance I then focused the rest of the analysis using the 2007 and 2008 COLB KOS image to pin the document into the middle of the known time frame.

Image 3. Overlays

The same measurement methodology was used against the full un-cropped KOS image and showed the security borders to be uncentered from left to right within the lower 2/3 rd portion of the 8 ½ x 11 inch page with a deviation from the other measurements off center being the average of 75 pixels – a 60 pixel greater deviation. Measurements were taken from the top left, top right, bottom left, bottom right, center top, and center bottom of each images security border to the edges of the visible paper which appeared as hard edges with the top cover of the scanners creating whitespace. The differences are also detectible visually without the use of digital enhancements.

 

Image 4.  measurement comparisons

The previously created overlays were placed on top of the image. When the 2007 overlay was placed on top of the image they did not immediately line up. After being matched from security border corner to security border corner with some minor variations on the minute angle of the images the security border pattern obviously did not match in pattern or in color. The fonts were observed to not be in the same locations and they also did not share same kerning. The procedure was then used with the 2008 overlay on top of the KOS image. Once again when the 2008 overlay was placed on top of the image they did not immediately line up. After being matched from corner to corner like the 2007 overlay again with some minor variations on the minute angle of the images the security border pattern obviously did not match in pattern or in color. The fonts were observed to not be in the same locations on the page and they also did not share same kerning. 

 

Image 5. with 2007 and 2008 overlays

A direct relative comparison using unmodified copies of the original images were made in regards to the security border pattern and color. Several distinctions were noted from the 2007 / 2008 certificate security border versus the security border used in the KOS image. 

Image 6. Border comparisons

Direct relative measurements using unmodified copies of the original images were made in regards to the font size and kerning. Several letters were distinctly different in width and kerning from the 2007 / 2008 certificate font versus the font used in the KOS image such as O, H, N, R, and C. 

Images 7 – 9. Animated GIFs showing kerning differences

The metadata and EXIF information was then extracted from the 2007, 2008, and the two images. The metadata extracted from the JPG files consisted of the quantization tables used for compressing the image and the EXIF data if it was present.

The 2007 image’s rate of compression was calculated to an approximated 75% quality factor at 300 dpi with an image size of 2550 x 3300 pixels in a portrait orientation and contained no EXIF data.

The 2008 image’s rate of compression was calculated to an approximated 80% quality factor at 300 dpi with an image size of 2550 x 3300 pixels in a portrait orientation and also contained no EXIF data.

The un-cropped image’s rate of compression was calculated to an approximated 90% quality factor at 300 dpi with an image size of 2550 x 3300 pixels in a portrait orientation and also contained the following relevant EXIF data:

[Software ] = Adobe Photoshop CS3 Macintosh

[DateTime ] = 2008:

06:12

08:42:36

[ColorSpace ] = 65535

[ExifImageWidth ] = 2550

[ExifImageHeight] = 3300

Raw Image Orientation = Portrait

Photoshop Save As Quality = [8]

Photoshop Save Format = [Progressive]

The cropped image’s rate of compression was calculated to an approximated 50% quality factor at 300 dpi with an image size of 2427 x 2369 pixels in a landscape orientation and also contained the following relevant EXIF data:

[Software ] = Adobe Photoshop CS3 Macintosh

[DateTime ] = 2008:

06:12

08:42:36

[ColorSpace ] = 65535

[ExifImageWidth ] = 2427

[ExifImageHeight] = 2369

Raw Image Orientation = Landscape

The 2007, 2008, and the two KOS images were then analyzed by creating a heat map showing where each pixel changes as jpeg quality decreases from 100 to 0. A change was considered relevant once the sum of the changes to the red, green, and blue values exceeded 10%. The heat map created from the 2007 and 2008 images showed the fonts, seal image, and security border are all identical consistent values. To eliminate any subjective presumptions and to increase the number of comparative tests the same analysis was then conducted on the 2006 and prior certificate images which all found the fonts, seal images, and security borders to also be saved with identical consistent values. The same analysis on the KOS images showed the security border having a substantially different RGB quality value than the fonts and the seal image. 

 

Image 10.  RGB value heat maps

 

Image 11. Detailed images of RGB value heat maps

The 2007, 2008, and the two KOS images were also analyzed for jpeg compression variations by creating a heat map showing where the difference for a particular compression level is indicated. A change was considered relevant once the sum of the changes to the error level values exceeded 10% of the previously calculated compression error rates. The heat map created from the 2007 and 2008 images showed the fonts, seal image, and security border are all identical consistent values. To eliminate any subjective presumptions and to increase the number of comparative tests the same analysis was then conducted on the 2006 and prior certificate images which all found the fonts, seal images, and security borders to also be compressed with identical consistent values. The same analysis on the KOS image indicated that the security border has a different error value than the fonts and the seal image. 

Image 12. Error level analysis heat maps

Image 13. Detailed images of error level analysis heat map

The image contains numerous visible artifacts located at various points throughout the image. These artifacts are not found on any other known good image from any examined time frame. I began creating a pixel level map of these errors by using a copy of the full un-cropped version and simply highlighting the areas by drawing a pixel wide line to the left and to the right of each visible flaw. The left side of the image towards the inside edge of the security border contained stray vertical lines that did not match up to any of the jpeg compression artifacts so they were highlighted. The right side of the image contained visual pixel level inconsistencies in the background hatch pattern. The right side pattern is visually consistent with the artifacts left after digitally erasing an area from an image and attempting to rebuild the background.

Image 14. Some random flaws highlighted

By connecting the points together the original placement of what appears to be part of the original security border becomes apparent. The placement of the lines matches the expected location of a good security border based on the known placement from the known good certificates. The width and spacing of the highlighted areas also match a 1:1 scale overlay from a section of a known good security border.

Image 15. Connected lines

A close examination of the security border itself reveals several repeating inconsistencies. Among them is a “weak line” which repeats once after every second bold line and a slightly downward curving end point where a straight line should end. This pattern continues around the entire perimeter of the security border. Upon very close inspection portions of the security border also repeat every 240 pixels. By mapping this repeating pattern it becomes apparent that the pattern is laid out as a 240 x 240 pixel square that can be accurately extrapolated to the next position by simply counting 240 pixels. This type of tiling effect is commonly seen when an image has been modified by filling an area using an image editing application’s tile or pattern fill function.

Image 16. Mapped border pattern

 

During the course of my analysis several calls were made to various departments in the Hawaiian State Government in an attempt to better understand the process and procedures used to create, print, and distribute copies of the COLB form. While I was brushed off or hung up upon by almost all of the people I contacted I did manage to talk with a computer technician who was familiar with the computers and printers used by the Department of Health and the clerk’s offices. He was unwilling to give any specific details but did provide enough information to work with. The COLB certificates are printed directly in the clerk’s office at the time they are requested. The system uses a standard laser printer and the border is printed at the same time as the text and other images on top of preprinted security paper. He stated the border is a vector image and would appear crisp and defined. When asked if a COLB can be printed off center he said it was not possible and any misfeed would simply jam in the printer. When asked if he had seen the images on-line he replied that he had – and that there is “no way” they had printed something that looked like that which further backed up my conclusions. Now let’s start to put the pieces of the puzzle together. The KOS image security border pattern does not match any known specimen from any known year. It does not match the pre-2006 nor does it match the post-2006 certificate patterns. The placement of the text in all of the pre-2006 and post-2006 certificates are almost identical pixel location matches while the image’s text placement does not match any known specimen from any known year. The shape and kerning of the fonts used in the 2006 through 2008 certificates are identical while the shape and kerning of the fonts used in the image does not match any known specimen. The KOS image shows clear signs of tampering such as the mismatch in RGB and error levels, visible indications of the previous location of the erased security border, easily detectable patterns of repeating flaws around the new security border, EXIF data that says the image was last saved with Photoshop CS3 for Macintosh, and finally a technician from Hawaii who confirms it just looks wrong.

There are two obvious scenarios used to create the image that can be ascertained from evidence. Either a real COLB was scanned into Photoshop and digitally edited or a real COLB was first scanned to obtain the graphic layout then blanked by soaking the document in solvent to remove the toner. After rescanning the blank page to a separate image the graphics from the previously obtained scan could then be easily applied to the blank scan after some editing and rebuilding. It would also explain why date stamp bleeds through the paper and the various bits of toner located around the image as well as the remnants of the previous location of a security border.

So as I have been saying repeatedly since I first compared the KOS images to the Decosta image using the same tests and measurements – the image is a horrible forgery.

Previously at Atlas: FORENSIC EXPERT: "the [birth] certificate is still a horrible forgery"

Mystery, Clarification and Obfuscation of Obama's Birth Certificate Forgery

Atlas Tech Expert Declares Obama Birth Certificate ...

Who died and made him the final word on Obama's ...

The "Missing" Obama Birth Certificate Seal 6/29/08

SUCH A LIAR: OBAMA'S FAKE BIRTH CERTIFICATE  6/26/08

RELEASE OBAMA'S BIRTH CERTIFICATE! 6/10/08

****Must Cite Pamela Geller and link back to Atlas ****(play nice and honest).

UPDATE: Techdude added this in the comment section:

..some folks asked for it...so here are MORE screen shots. I uploaded a few from the 2001 and 2003 COLB tests and the animated gifs showing the fun pulsating kerning differences ala LGF style.

I assume no one has been able to figure out why the "2007" KOS image manages to have the same placement as a 2003 COLB and not a 2006, 2007, or 2008 COLB yet huh? How about the remnants of the previous border location? Humm...and what about that mis-matching uncentered border with obvious 2 pixel white spaces between the top and bottom headers? Any more novel theories? Space aliens? Right wing conspiracies? Oh I know...it must have all been a "satire" of a real one.

              Decosta error level

          Decosta RGB Heat map

                2003 RGB Heat map

    2007 on KOS animated - kerning differences

            Animated gif - kerning differences

2003 over 2007

                                                        2007 overlay on Decosta

UPDATE: Israeli Insider weighs in here

UPDATE: lol

UPDATE: ACTION ALERT: ANY ATLAS READERS LIVE IN HAWAII? Reader Henry suggested we  check the newspapers around the date of his birth in the vital statics area and see if they list his birth. Local libraries usually have old newspapers on microfiche. Depending on the newspaper, they might list the hopital as well as the time, date, parents. It won't tell us religion, color, Arab or African etc.... but it would verify his birthplace.

*** Copyright © 2005-2008 Pamela Geller | All Rights Reserved *** (credit and link back to Atlas)

Comments

[john jay]

techdude:

awesome, dude.

it is interesting to see what the apologist[s] for the kos document have to say.

pamela:

yes, atlasshrugs is awesome, too. a really fine, definitive report on the issue of the authenticity of the daily kos document. it is a phoney.

the question must be asked, why has this document been fronted.

the further question must be asked, and it is of most importance, and that is, why has osama bin bama not offered a legitimate certificate of live birth, capable of authentication in proof of his assertion of citizenship.

finally, this observation must be made.-- the democratic party should be very careful that it nominates somebody to run for potus who is, in fact and in law, eligible to be elected to office. those stories circulating of obama's birth in kenya and subsequent application for a c.o.l.b. in hawii take on a new resonance.

john jay

[kobi]

the dhimmicrats may be waiting until the election...if oybomba gets in and then is proved ineligible...won't the office go to the vp?

i hope that this will be taken to court asap.

[cjean]

Thank you Techdude! Thank you Pamela!

[JBean]

Excellent work, Techdude!
I have a feeling KOS is about the see what the underside of the bus looks like. As Pamela asks: Why? Why do something this stupid? The answer, or lack thereof, should be interesting, to say the least.

[Shy Guy]

I don't understand.

US law requires Presidents to be native born US citizens.

If someone cannot or refuses to prove it, how can they be a presidential candidate?

[bvw]

With all respect and regard for yourself and techdude -- there is now also a civic duty as great as uncovering the forgery in the identifying, finding and questioning the cretins who vandalized the car and who tortured the rabbit to death, both done to intimidate an investigator into a key matter of a federal election.

[Ray_in_Aus]

The sociologists and statistics experts will find this politically driven erroneous report quite fascinating, and the Mac users will step up their bragging about their superior software.

[Spectre]

"Either a real COLB was scanned into Photoshop and digitally edited or a real COLB was first scanned to obtain the graphic layout then blanked by soaking the document in solvent to remove the toner. After rescanning the blank page to a separate image the graphics from the previously obtained scan could then be easily applied to the blank scan after some editing and rebuilding. It would also explain why date stamp bleeds through the paper and the various bits of toner located around the image as well as the remnants of the previous location of a security border."

That would also explain why the border lines are not as crisp (washed out) as on the authentic certificate.

Here's a dumb question - If the seal is impressed on the back of the certificate, and was seen on the front in the KOS certificate, wouldn't the seal appear as a mirror image on the front if stamped on the back? I am not a forensic document examiner, but any bleed through stamps from the back of a document generally appear as a reversed image on the front. Or is the representation here that the KOS certificate was stamped on the front and not on the back (if so, it would further seem that we would have a better image of the seeal)?

[turn]

Shy Guy-

There are many qualifications for being a 'native born' citizen. McCain was born in Panama and is fully able legal to be POTUS.

If Obomba was naturalized (as my ex is) there would be public records.

If he was born in Kenya and transported to Hawaii then his COLB would have needed to be forged at least by the time he entered public school in Hawaii after returning from Indonesia.

[Pamela Geller]

hey Ray_in_Aus -- who are you working for?

someone wrote: "AJ called out Techdude, expert in the field of forensic digital forgery examination in a ridiculously titled post: How 9-11 Helped Cause The Obama Birth Certificate Silliness. The thing I don't understand is why doesn't AJ wait for this expert's full report which we have emphatically made clear would be released shortly."

[to which Ray responded]

Presumably because AJ has an IQ that is high enough for him to see that no credible "report" will never be forthcoming.

double negative- literally and metaphorically :)here

[Pamela Geller]

Look, if there was a birth certficate in Kenya, why wouldn't McCain (or the Clintonistas back when she wanted that nomination more than life itself) tracked it down.

Further, why wouldn't the Kenyan President Mwai Kibaki release it. Obama vigorously supported and campaigned for Odinga. Odinga is Kibaki's arch rival and nemesis. Odinga was/is a violent inciter that caused Kibaki and the Kenyan people no small punishment of blood and violence.

Obama and Odinga alliance here. Scroll for campaign pictures of Obama and Odinga together.

All I am saying is we don't know why. The question is why.

[Ray_in_Aus]

Pamela Geller wrote:

hey Ray_in_Aus -- who are you working for?

someone wrote: "AJ called out Techdude, expert in the field of forensic digital forgery examination in a ridiculously titled post: How 9-11 Helped Cause The Obama Birth Certificate Silliness. The thing I don't understand is why doesn't AJ wait for this expert's full report which we have emphatically made clear would be released shortly."

[to which Ray responded]

Presumably because AJ has an IQ that is high enough for him to see that no credible "report" will never be forthcoming.

double negative- literally and metaphorically :
====================

[Ray]: That minor error ("never" -v- "ever") was the result of inserting alternative text, but I assumed everyone would join the dots. In any case I as right about AJ Strata's IQ. The report is not at all credible.

It might have got 6 out of 10 in a competition to write a fictional account of an Obama COLB forgery, but in a forgery trial the expert witness for the prosecution would probably have the jury laughing, and the prosecutor would be reprimanded and declared to be a vexatious litigant.

[Pamela Geller]

but in a forgery trial the expert witness for the prosecution would probably have the jury laughing,

uh ... techdude is and has been the expert witness for the prosecution....

lol

[Ray_in_Aus]

Well obviously not for anything like this.

[norman]

I don't think all this stuff is going to make one bit of difference to the outcome of the election, in which I believe Obama will win. After what Bill Clinton got away with before and during his presidency, all standards have been discarded. Most of the people voting today don't care about our traditional standards. It looks like a downward trajectory. Another great empire is stumbling to its end.

[Yidwithlid]

Ray_in_Aus
Its easy to put something down...much harder to prove it... IF this was a trial the other side would bring in a forensics expert of their own to disprove the other's story. WHERE IS YOURS POSTED?
Oh nowhere? so you are criticizing with out expert facts? Sounds like obamas statements on the surge.

[kingronjo]

Hey Pam,

excuse my dopiness, but has anyone thought to ask his Grandma? After she shakes off the track marks from the bus I believe she might have some insight as to where the Messiah was born. Perhaps she will say, perhaps not, worth a phone call tho.

And I unfortunately agree with Ray, Obama at one of the debates could emphatically declare, "I was born in Red China and am the Manchurian candidate" and he still would get the votes he's going to get.

[john jay]

ray_in_aus:

techdude has said all along that he welcomes peer review of his work.

it is public. it explains his methodology. it has the empirical results of his testing. it is open to scrutiny and criticism.

i suspect, ... , hell, i am fully confident, that it will stand to peer review.

the implications of the report are quite obvious to all but the most incredulous of minds.--the state of hawaii prints consistently good and substantially identical document, e.g., c.o.l.b.'s, every time out the printer, and the daily kos does not measure up in terms of image quality, image, ink mixture, and the very locations and patterns on the borders of the document. the daily kos document, in all probability, therefore, was not printed/created by the state of hawaii, it does not meet its standards of consistency, and the document is a fake and those who propound it do so presumably for ulterior motive.

let us see what the peer review says.

techdude has done a courageous thing. he has prepared his report, he has published it, and he has put it into the public scrutiny where it will stand or fall.

others have voiced opinions, not capable of substantiation, and most certainly not capable of review or testing, and therefore not subject to any meaningful criticism. a test of warm breezes, as it were.

techdude is a stalwart fellow, personally and intellectually. i laud him.

john jay
milton freewater, oregon usa

[Ray_in_Aus]

norman wrote:

"I don't think all this stuff is going to make one bit of difference to the outcome of the election [....] "

Of course it won't because Obama WAS born in August 1961 in Hawaii and he DIDN'T participate in any forgery of his COLB. If Obama is the Democrats preferred leader on election day his party should score well and he will not be undermined by any of this eligibility stuff.

This whole issue has made me think more about what AJ said about propaganda - and how some of it gets out of hand. Frankly, I disagree with some of his view about the amount of propaganda that has prevailed, but this whole exercise has put me in a frame of mind to re-visit some of it.

I wasn't aware of how much the media (on both sides of the fence) lied and distorted things until last year when I was following the Gitmo stuff very closely, but this exercise has shown me that the distortion goes way beyond the media.

[Ray_in_Aus]

kingronjo wrote:

And I unfortunately agree with Ray, Obama at one of the debates could emphatically declare, "I was born in Red China and am the Manchurian candidate" and he still would get the votes he's going to get.
-----

I'm not sure what we agree upon, but let me prefix this by saying that personally I'd like to see Hillary win - not because she's the best person for the job, but because she's the best the Democrats can put in the job.

Obama is however looking better all the time (to me) despite him seeming like some sort of 'Hollywood production' built to a winning formula that is guaranteed to suck in the impressionable voters. The only BIG thing he's got (in my book) is his reasonable understanding of Islam as well as the terrorists NOT seeing him as "another white guy with the same old values". That could be good for world peace.

[kingronjo]

Ray wrote:

I don't think all this stuff is going to make one bit of difference to the outcome of the election, in which I believe Obama will win.

Pretty clear to follow I thought that anything The Messian says or does will not sway those who follow him with a religious fervor. Only hope is the 'bitter clingers' who aren't smart to recognize his perfection.

[Ray_in_Aus]

Yidwithlid wrote:

"Its easy to put something down...much harder to prove it... IF this was a trial the other side would bring in a forensics expert of their own to disprove the other's story. WHERE IS YOURS POSTED?" [...]

If there was a trial, the onus would be on the prosecution to prove beyond reasonable doubt that Obama (a) Provided a false birth date and location and (b) Conspired to forge a digital image with the intention to defraud. He would not have to prove a thing. He could however discredit more than enough of the allegations to have the case tossed out of court.

[Ray_in_Aus]

kingronjo wrote:

Ray wrote:

I don't think all this stuff is going to make one bit of difference to the outcome of the election, in which I believe Obama will win.

Pretty clear to follow I thought that anything The Messian says or does will not sway those who follow him with a religious fervor. Only hope is the 'bitter clingers' who aren't smart to recognize his perfection.

I didn't write that - it was norman. You probably got the names mixed up because of the illogical way the names are placed with posts on this blog.

Ray

[RISE_UP]

Obama is however looking better all the time (to me) despite him seeming like some sort of 'Hollywood production' built to a winning formula that is guaranteed to suck in the impressionable voters. The only BIG thing he's got (in my book) is his reasonable understanding of Islam as well as the terrorists NOT seeing him as "another white guy with the same old values". That could be good for world peace.

Don't that say it all? Let me see....(just a few.List too long to type)
Obama understands there are 57 states.
Dead men attend his rallies.....
The japanese dropped a bomb on Pearl Harbor....
and now he understands Islam....
Last and perfect description of all above...BULLLLLL SHIT

[se]

Why do you use the Michele COLB to claim that the text in the Obama COLB is in a different location?

Were you not aware of the fact that the location of the text in the Obama COLB is in the SAME location as the text in the DeCosta, Smith and Tomoyasu COLBs? And that it is in fact the text in the Michele COLB which is in a different location than ALL of the others, including Obama's?

Did this oversight occur due to VERY sloppy analysis, or was it an intentional attempt to deceive?

se

[herself311]

This needs to get out to the American public. I sent it on but others have to, also. How do we get the media to take a look....or a district attorney to have more experts look at Obama's birth certificate? If it is indeed a forgery, this man needs to be prosecuted followed by prison. This is a serious crime.

[Ray_in_Aus]

john jay wrote:

ray_in_aus:

techdude has said all along that he welcomes peer review of his work.

it is public. it explains his methodology. it has the empirical results of his testing. it is open to scrutiny and criticism.

i suspect, ... , hell, i am fully confident, that it will stand to peer review.

No it won't. It's full of holes.

the implications of the report are quite obvious to all but the most incredulous of minds.--the state of hawaii prints consistently good and substantially identical document, e.g., c.o.l.b.'s, every time out the printer, and the daily kos does not measure up in terms of image quality, image, ink mixture, and the very locations and patterns on the borders of the document.

No, That's not the case at all. They produce 3rd rate images. I've been a graphic reproducer for a long time and I wouldn't dare to delivers stuff like that to a big customer like a Health Department - especially for certificates that people value or treasure.

the daily kos document, in all probability, therefore, was not printed/created by the state of hawaii, it does not meet its standards of consistency, and the document is a fake and those who propound it do so presumably for ulterior motive.

let us see what the peer review says.

Non-peers could knock over most of the report.

techdude has done a courageous thing. he has prepared his report, he has published it, and he has put it into the public scrutiny where it will stand or fall.

Yes, of course it's courageous. A lot of effort has been put in, but I wouldn't be surprised if he was biased before he started. In any case it's a fascinating puzzle for us all to follow, so it's not a waste of time.

others have voiced opinions, not capable of substantiation, and most certainly not capable of review or testing, and therefore not subject to any meaningful criticism. a test of warm breezes, as it were.

I disagree. I think most people's statements could be followed up and the issues could be resolved if there was enough incentive, such as enough readers who wanted a definitive answer about an issue.

techdude is a stalwart fellow, personally and intellectually. i laud him.

Well we've all seen how some high flying lawyers have lost some big cases in the Supreme Courts throughout the years - and they too looked very credible on the surface.

In Australia I think our Federal government loses about 50% of it's cases in the Hight Court (the equivalent of the U.S. Supreme Court).

Ray

[se]

My apologies. It wasn't the MicheleCOLB that was used for the text shifting.

However the text location in the Obama COLB is the same as the location for the DeCosta, Smith and Tomoyasu COLBs.

se

[john jay]

ray_in_aus:

a few simple questions posed to you, and, direct replies from you, if you would.--

why does not the obama for potus campaign simply produce barrack obama's original birth certificate from the state of hawaii, if there is one?

why will not the obama for potus campaign waive all privacy interests in the birth certificate purportedly in the possession of the state of hawaii's department of vital statistics and authorized the registrar of hawaii's vital statistics to release the document to the public?

he is, afterall, running for president of the united states, and should be willing to definitively establish the bona fides of his birth, and of his citizenship. it doesn't seem to be too much to ask of him, after all, he wants so much more from all of us. he wants us to give him the authority of his finger on "the button:" the very least he should do is prove definitively that he is an american citizen eligible to run for president. as a matter of fact, he is legally required to prove that.

john jay
milton freewater, oregon usa

[Yidwithlid]

ray_in_aus you say its full of holes...PLEASE Get your expert and show us the holes. There is no football on today so I am free all day. Produce your expert because all you are showing is your bravado.

[Ray_in_Aus]

RISE_UP wrote:

[Ray]: Obama is however looking better all the time (to me) despite him seeming like some sort of 'Hollywood production' built to a winning formula that is guaranteed to suck in the impressionable voters. The only BIG thing he's got (in my book) is his reasonable understanding of Islam as well as the terrorists NOT seeing him as "another white guy with the same old values". That could be good for world peace.

Don't that say it all? Let me see....(just a few.List too long to type)
Obama understands there are 57 states.
Dead men attend his rallies.....
The japanese dropped a bomb on Pearl Harbor....

A few more than one bomb, but there would have been a LOT less bombs dropped if the Australian pilots' frantic messages had been passed on to Pearl Harbor. "Japanese armada heading to Pearl in a scorpion formation" (that formation is an ancient Japanese war formation).

They got us badly on the way back (one third of the fleet). Most of it was kept secret for 60 years.

Ray

[Dale in Atlanta]

I've been reading "Ray_in_Aus" comments, over at AJ's board, as well as here, ever since he inserted himself into this discussion as some kind of "expert"!

Unlike "Techdude", who has proven his expertise, and who is, "Ray", has only hurled insults, and demands that we believe him, with no proof, nor technical analysis.

Even AJ tried to prove it technically.

Now, I'm not a technical "expert"; so I've had to watch this play off between "techdude", and AJ; I think they both have honorable intent, and for the non-technical among us, we have to make our own judgement, based upon the competing versions, and decide who to believe.

But as for "Ray" in Australia, the very fact that he admitted above, that he's a Hillary AND an Obama Fan, immediately Invalidates any and all things he says in this discussion.

End of story; "Ray" has no expertise, and more important, anything he says regarding it is clearly slanted in favor of Obama, thus feel free to ignore any and all his statements henceforth!

PS: "Ray", I was correct, here, and over AJ's, when I said this was a forgery, and once and for all, "techdude" has proven it.

[Ray_in_Aus]

Yidwithlid wrote:

ray_in_aus you say its full of holes...PLEASE Get your expert and
show us the holes. There is no football on today so I am free all day.
Produce your expert because all you are showing is your bravado.

I don't need any hangers' on. I'm an expert in graphic reproduction
myself. Besides that, there's AJ and a few others here who have
already pointed to some of the glaring problems with the allegations
of forgery by Techdude and Polarik.

Ray

[Dale in Atlanta]

"Ray" in Australia, disputing "techdude's" analysis:

"Ah, yeah Mate, like I'm an Expert myself Dude, and ah...I'm in love with Obama, okay dude, so like. er...ah...."techdude's" analysis is all off man, like....really....so now I'm gonna go catch a wave mate, and throw some shrimp on the barbie, dude....er...yeah!"

[Ray_in_Aus]

Dale in Atlanta wrote:

But as for "Ray" in Australia, the very fact that he admitted above, that he's a Hillary AND an Obama Fan, immediately Invalidates any and all things he says in this discussion.

What sort of logic is that? It seems that you mind, a person's technical skills are directly related to their current political opinion?

Also, where on earth did you get the idea that a person's political preference is an "admission". It sounds like your sense of logic is completely whacked.

[Ray_in_Aus]

Let me state my challenge to Polarik and Techdude again:

You show us a small sample of what you reckon the phantom-forger did, and let us show you how e can spot the 'forgery'. Obviously you would need to use different names and dates.

[bvw]

Ray, as "an expert in graphic reproduction" you must have some work you are very proud of having had graphically reproduced? Perhaps you might share some of your portfolio with us?

Best regards!

[Dale in Atlanta]

Ray, there's no "idea" about it; you're in the tank for Obama, by your own admission. That immediatedly invalidates any and all "opinions" or "expertise" you have on this topic.

By your own admission, you are NOT to be considered "unbiased" or someone not having a dog in this fight.

Number two, you denigrate "techdude", and his analysis, but yet you've never supplied your own technical expertise, nor knowledge, just endless pablum about how it's this and that, and so obvious, etc.

For someone who is SUPPOSED to be an "expert"; you've supplied little if any "expertise"!

Finally, "techdude", and I wouldn't know him from Adam, has laid his resume out there, for all to see, and has already been harassed as a result:

Insofar as "techdude's" credentials, he is an active member of the Association of Certified Fraud Examiners, American College of Forensic Examiners, The International Society of Forensic Computer Examiners, International Information Systems Forensics Association - the list goes on. He also a board certified as a forensic computer examiner, a certificated legal investigator, and a licensed private investigator. He has been performing computer based forensic investigations since 1993 ....

"Ray", where is YOURS?

Other than an unsupported declaration that "I'm an expert", and then mocking "techdude"'s report, NOTHING, NADA, ZIP, ZILCH!

Okay "expert"; let's see YOUR resume?

Okay "expert", let's see YOUR point-by-point refutation of "techdude's" analysis?

Until you put up, or shut up, YOU GOT NOTHING!

FACT!

[Ray_in_Aus]

Some good technical answers can be found on this new blog:
Get some peanuts and take a seat.
http://koyaan.wordpress.com/

[Ray_in_Aus]

Dale in Atlanta wrote:

Ray, there's no "idea" about it; you're in the tank for Obama, by your own admission. That immediatedly invalidates any and all "opinions" or "expertise" you have on this topic.

According to your err.. 'unusual' sense of the logical, any technical opinion of mine wouldn't be credible anyway because I have expressed a preference for 2 political candidates.

By your own admission, you are NOT to be considered "unbiased" or someone not having a dog in this fight.

You seem incapable of distinguishing between having a "dog in a political *fight*' and having a dog in technical debate. This is NOT a fight. The misguided investigators have been, and will continue to be, corrected.

Ray

[nutiket]

Ray the expert graphic designer:

An argument is presented which offers many related details and specific conclusions. You may be an "expert graphic designer" but you are no logician.

If you had the courage of your convictions and the ability you would refute the argument in a systematic way, without relying on solely on your self-proclaimed expertise, and illustrated by facts. The argument is wrong... because you say so. There are expert BS detectors here who see through your lazy invective.

[Ray_in_Aus]

bvw wrote:

Ray, as "an expert in graphic reproduction" you must have some work you are very proud of having had graphically reproduced? Perhaps you might share some of your portfolio with us?

That would be getting away from the debate. We really need to focus on the array of supposed flaws in Obama's COLB by Polarik and Techdude and see if any of them make sense. I say none of them do.

[nutiket]

Apology to Ray: "expert graphic designer" s/b "expert in graphic reproduction". In any event, not a logician. It would be nice to see some expert graphic reproductions since they do appear to be his only relevant qualification.

[Yidwithlid]

Ray- heres the problem, I know techdudes credentials, whats your's please send them to Atlas so she can confirm. Techdude gave us a step by step analysis of why he thinks it is Crap. I am not an expert but it seems believable to me. You are saying that you are an expert, build a case and convince me. I will read it and compare, otherwise you are just giving us a BS line

[Dale in Atlanta]

This is "techdude":

Insofar as "techdude's" credentials, he is an active member of the Association of Certified Fraud Examiners, American College of Forensic Examiners, The International Society of Forensic Computer Examiners, International Information Systems Forensics Association - the list goes on. He also a board certified as a forensic computer examiner, a certificated legal investigator, and a licensed private investigator. He has been performing computer based forensic investigations since 1993 ....

this is "Ray" from Australia:

..........................................................chirp...................chirp......

Yep, I thought so; instead of answering the question, showing your bonifedes, or providing us with a Point-by-Point Technical refutation of "techdude's" report; you choose to try and move the goal posts, and change the discussion to the FACT that I RIGHTLY pointed out, by your OWN admission, you are in the tank for Obama, and thus anything and everything you say on this topic is immediately susptect!

Then you refer us to a Blog, set up for the specific purpose of refuting "techdude", that just like you, has got nothing!

So, my orignal comments, stand, as PROVEN:

a) I was correct all along, this is a forgery; I didn't need "expertise" such as you purportedly possess, I only needed Commonsense that a major Presidential Campaign, would NOT release their COLB thru a Leftwing Nutbag website, such as the Daily Kos!

b) You have NO "expertist" until you release your resume, as "techdude" as done!

c) By your own admission, you are in the tank for Obama, so any/all of yoru analysis is invalidated!

d) you cannot, and apparantly will not deliver on your snarky, denigrating comments vis a vis "techdude's report and analysis, because you are incapable, and because you are politically in the tank of Obama

You lose "Ray"; "techdude" has exposed your ....ah...."shortcomings" in public; you've been Pantsed!

So, the challenge still stands: PUT UP, or SHUT UP!!

[Ray_in_Aus]

nutiket wrote:

Ray the expert graphic designer:

An argument is presented which offers many related details and specific conclusions. You may be an "expert graphic designer" but you are no logician.

Graphic reproducer - not graphic designer. I'm actually quite useless at design or drawing.

If you had the courage of your convictions and the ability you would refute the argument in a systematic way, without relying on solely on your self-proclaimed expertise, and illustrated by facts. The argument is wrong... because you say so. There are expert BS detectors here who see through your lazy invective.

I won't argue with that. You're right, I have hung back and watched the others with various experience do their thing, and they've come up with angles that I hadn't thought of or couldn't be bothered doing, particularly "se" or "koyaan" on this blog:
http://koyaan.wordpress.com/

AJ seems to have some very high grade training that most of us would know nothing about, which equipped him for discerning the difference between something that is real and "background noise" - whether it's in graphical or numeric form or any other, so while our backgrounds are quite different, it's easy to see that he knows how to filter out patent b.s. in something as simple as a digital document and debaters who keep deliberately changing the topic to low grade politics.

Ray

[Ray_in_Aus]

Yidwithlid wrote:

Ray- heres the problem, I know techdudes credentials, whats your's please send them to Atlas so she can confirm. Techdude gave us a step by step analysis of why he thinks it is Crap. I am not an expert but it seems believable to me. You are saying that you are an expert, build a case and convince me. I will read it and compare, otherwise you are just giving us a BS line

I have never understood the mentality of people who regard credentials and resumes as being more important than hard evidence - because ultimately it's goodevidence that usually wins case where it really counts.

Ray

[Spectre]

Well, it appears that Australia is giving the US a good run regarding its population of those mesmerized by Obama.

The fact that Ray in Aus has expressed his support for one side over the other is INDEED logical and cogent in assessing his views. While Ray claims to have some background in legal standards concerning expert testimony, his comments here belie that claim.

Bias is something that directly impacts one's credibility. And one's credibility is THE major factor in the weight given to the testimony of an expert. Ray would have us believe that folks in Australia are more naieve than those in the US, and would fail to give any weight to an expert's personal bias or interests regarding their views. having dealt with more than a few fine people from down under, I can say that my experience does not support that view.

In additon to personal bias, one's background in the particular area of interest is of paramount importance. A person claiming to be an expert on the internet is not automaticallu imbued with that status. For all we know, Ray suffers from excessive spore inhaliation from spending too much time in his mother's basement between his junior high school classes. Certainly, based on his commentary here, I would tend to favor the junior high spore inhaler tag over his claim to be an expert in the area of image forensics. And if we needed any more convincing, his refusal to validate his claim by employing the ruse that to address his qualifications would be "getting away from the debate" is puts that issue to rest. Ray has taken the coward's way out of the put up or shut up challenge by his tactful slither away from the question. The smart money is on Ray's experitise in graphic reproduction being limited to making copies on a Xerox machine.

Sorry Ray, but it would appear the only expertise you can come close to laying a claim upon is in the area of being an internet troll - I believe that's "wanker" where you come from.

[se]

Ok. Here's my long and the short of it.

Unless the 2006 and 2007 borders are being misrepresented in terms of their dates, then the Obama certificate is almost certainly a fake.

The Obama border isn't just a bad representation of the 2006-2008 borders, it's simply not the same border, period. The pitch of the hashmarks in the other COLBs are identical. The pitch of the hashmarks in the Obama COLB is completely different.

As I'd said a number of times previously, what was needed were COLBs more contemporary to the Obama COLB. One just before, and one just after. The Michele COLB gave us the "just after" but there had yet been no just before released.

Now, assuming they're not being misrepresented, we have them.

And it in the end, the analysis didn't require anything fancy. Just a pair of eyes.

se

[Dale in Atlanta]

AJ seems to have some very high grade training that most of us would know nothing about, which equipped him for discerning the difference between something that is real and "background noise" - whether it's in graphical or numeric form or any other, so while our backgrounds are quite different, it's easy to see that he knows how to filter out patent b.s. in something as simple as a digital document and debaters who keep deliberately changing the topic to low grade politics.

Ray

Posted by:Ray_in_Aus | Sunday, July 20, 2008 at 03:48 PM

WOW!

After more than a week of passing yourself off as some sort of "expert", denigrating "techdude" all over AJ's Blog, implying that AJ was correct because YOU knew better, and YOU had the "expertise" to support AJ's contentions, and basically saying that everyone that disagreed with you and AJ were idiots and didn't know what they were talking about, NOW, you melt under the pressure and scrutiny, and ADMIT you got nothing!

NOTHING!

You Sir, are a FRAUD!

And then, you throw this in here, just like a typical Lefist, the part I particulary love, is that you are in SUPPOSEDLY in Australia, not even the US; your inserting yourself into this, and pulling a typical Leftist stunt, shows how farranging the Lefist mental disease really has spread:

"and debaters who keep deliberately changing the topic to low grade politics."

That comment, coupled with your admitted "in-the-tank" for Obama statement, plus your constant referral to the "Koyaan" website, which is NOT yours, and which has proven NOTHING so far, proves that your sole intent in this entire affair, was to butress any/all support of the Obama COLB are "real", while attacking and denigrating any/all attempts to prove it WAS a forgery; while at the same time, pulling the typical Leftist tactic of being a "victim", and, accusing others of playing "politics", when you are in fact, surreptiously playing "politics" by attempting to pass a forgery off as a "real" COLB!

How decidedly Machiavellian and typically Leftist of you!

WOW!