Waiting for Abu Godot

Living in a state of wait. Making my way downtown. Lexington Avenue. View looking north on Lex. Busy as a bee.

Pivot and this is the view looking South.

Closed. Closed to vehicular and pedestrian traffic. No biggie right? Wrong. It's huge. A huge pain in the ass for EVERYONE. Enormous. No one talks about it. Sort of like the elephant man in the room and "helloo how are you, you nevuh looked bettuh."
The fallout from one bad Teddy Roosevelt steam pipe (if that is actually true) - one building down, one dead, several injured. Midtown crippled (hard to imagine how many millions have been lost by businesses in the hot spot) and this is nothing.

Cops standing on innocuous corners watching. Law enforcement knows.

I clock the war. It's what I do. I watch, I report and observe - I tell you when it's an observation. I distinguish between the actual news and my opinion. Something the mainstream media stopped doing long ago. They abdicated their role as public servant in delivering the news. So regular folks like myself had to go to work to get our news. Difficult it was. And had I not been in the position to do that (home with my kids at the time) I would not have been able to.

Hence the blogs, and that's why they rose so far so fast and the majority of America is not even tuned in yet.  They will come. They will have to. They will have to choose their news editors. I may have come to it earlier but it's just a matter of timing.

The crisis of our time is so pressing, so imminent, it has seized me. To my very core. I walk the streets f New York and feel as if I am walking the garden of the Finzi-Continis. If anyone cares enough to pay attention, the worst of signs are all there. As much as I might want to take a day, a weekend off, it is seemingly not possible. Even the responsible news channels are not necessarily the news. They are loathe to mention Islam,  jihad, the fight of our lives.  They won't do it. Any other story? No problem. But if any news story has even the slightest indication of Islamic jihad, it's blackout. The jihad never rests and it is gaining. On us.

And the left derides the messenger. So interesting to me. Why not hunker down and fight the enemy together? And then make your power play. Certainly a house divided cannot stand. Is this what they want?  Apparently so, as they have aligned themselves with the terrorist force. This was so startling to me at first - it has no logic. The very dogma that would hang them from the gallows for their homosexuality, bind up a  leftist feminist so tight she ceases to exist - this very dogma they secretly (and not so secretly) root for. Aid. Abet. Wild.

Even  the"warmongering" President falls into the trap. Bush makes the case brilliantly for fighting the jihad in Iraq but is thoroughly inconsistent in dealing with Fatah, Islamic jihad, al qaeda, and the enemy in our midst. This won't work. You can't win in Iraq and lose everywhere else. He can't even bring himself to utter the word Islamic jihad-or Islamic anything except to pay the jiyza. And the rare instance when he dares to step out and say something meaningful, he is beaten with an islamophobic racist club by groups that ought to have been ostracized by America the way the KKK was back in the day.

Anyway, in New York it's a waiting game. And the reality on the ground is a juxta to everything you see and hear in the media. Something is afoot, there is most definitely a warlike tonality. Call me Moshe the beadle if you like, but that's the emis.

I envy my neighbors their oblivion. Street chat, "you going to the golf outing?," "yeah, she's leaving Monday, gonna clean out her desk, "jet blue has a deal ...........," and it's not just the citizenry.

and here I am giving the play by play on the road to no return.

Have a nice day! :)

 

Comments

[Jeremiah]

Oh, Pam - you're flying above, not with, the angels.

[wxjames]

Love ya Pam. 2 if by sea, babe.

[Gary]

I hear Ya, Pam.

So far in my admittedly limited reading on the Jihad, both Oriana Fallaci and Mark Steyn have warned about the Secualrists doing all they can to sink us, rather than stand by us.

I encountered one of those people on Jihad Watch. He went by the names of giaour and nariz. For all that the entire world is threatened by the islamofascists, this... person, was in constant hysterics over Christianity. And until it was beaten out of him, had words to say against the Jews, as well.

They want to win their war against us and still be protected from islam. I guess at least a few of them realize that trying to use islam to futher their goals, is a supremely bad idea.

*ponders* Pam, I don't think this is the first, maybe not even the second, incident they are claiming was of 'Other' causes. I find it strange that the ONE bridge in all of San Francisco (wrong city? Please correct me), which terrorist web sites had mentioned would be a good target, was destroyed a month or two back, when a tanker truck slammed into it and burst into flames.

[Jeremiah]

Gary, that was an inner-city highway in Oakland, approaching the Bay Bridge. It's "the other bridge" connecting to SF (and actually conducts more traffic than the Golden Gate).

[john jay]

friends:

spot on.

very well written.

the poop us going to hit the fan.

john jay

[tazzerman2000]

Wow! Powerful! Pam, in all the time I've read your blog, listened to your 'casts and everything else, this one single post puts it ALL into perspective.

Realisim sucks, but the alternative is to be a 'liberal'....

[x_dhimmi]

This is your best writing, Pamela. Feels surreal reading it. I just wish it was fiction. But it's not, and forewarned is forearmed. God bless you and all who flock here to assemble with like minds. God bless America.

[x_dhimmi]

Shesh, I just noticed the URL to this post: . . . waiting-for-god . . .

See? You've affected my mood, and I'm more aware. :)

[Catmoves]

Non news is the new standard to keep all the media from lawsuits.
Our wonderful elected representatives from both parties are inclined to shoot from the hip. It seems that they have forgotten that mainly innocent bystanders are going to be hurt. I, for one one, am convinced that neither Bush nor his closest advisors had any knowledge about what could and would happen when the already firmly entrenched religious rules were broken when the US invaded Iraq. They seem to have been convinced it would be another "Operation Desert Storm". Your voice crying out needs to be heard. I will create a link to this article on my blog.

[Timur]

The only way a terrorist attack will be reported in the MSM is if there is no possible way it can be denied or explained away, i.e., it will only be reported as such if it is obvious to everyone that the Moslems are behind it. This is for 3 reasons: (1) it will not increase "Islamophobia" in the West and prevent attacks on Moslems living here (keep us "united"), (2) it will not give the terrorists a propaganda advantage and strengthen their image thereby weakening the West's image and (3) it will promote "business as usual" among John Q. Public, because if the economy goes down, they win.
Nothing to see here folks, move along, move along......

[Rebel Radius]

We all feel the pain, the rage of frustration.

Are we doing enough?

[jkp]

"step out and say something meaningful, he is beaten with an islamophobic racist groups." This tool is digusting and constantly used. Racism is irrational, phobias are irrational. The only problem with this label is that we are worried about culture, not race.

Culturism is a term I have coined to make it clear that we are not talking about race, we are talking about culture. Diversity is real. Not all cultures are compatable with liberal democracy. Islam's repeated intimidation in the face of free speech provides evidence.

Culturism recognizes Atlas' call to value and protect Western culture. That's what its all about baby. Five free review copies of culturism are yours for the asking. Contact me via culturism.us. Go Atlas, go Atlas readers!!

[kingronjo]

You know Pam, when the history of WWII was written the stepping stones to the war were so obvious it was if only a blind man could not see. Take a look at all of the Nazi's and Imperial Japan's provocations and from 70 years later we marvel that the statesmen of the West were so clueless.

Why does something tell me that 70 years after the first WMD attack on us (NYC?) the historians will be marveling at how blind our statesmen were. Assuming, of course, we are the ones writing the history. Of that there is no guarantee.

[akak]

http://www.ustreas.gov/press/releases/po3465.htm

[duncan]

Writing like this will not win you any converts. For those who have not taken the Kool Aid, it will certainly come across as rather unhinged.

[john jay]

duncan:
are you capable of nothing else, do you taste nothing but bile, nothing but bitter gall? who else feels your wrath? your pain?
.j.

[Bomb Bomb Iran]

Atlas, please look at the first two posts on this blog:

http://antiracistblog.blogspot.com/

They talks about anti-semitic/anti-Israel Bard University Professor Joel Kovel. He has a horrible new book out, and is saying some pretty despicable things on his book tour.

Joel Kovel was the Green party candidate for NY Senate, and was the runner-up to Ralph Nader for the Green Party's 2000 Presidential nomination.

Please expose this horrible person! Keep up the great work.

[lonbud]

Well, I haven't stopped by since the Republican party was whining and moaning about the use of the motion for cloture by the minority party in congress, but I see little has changed in PamsWorld during the interim.

Still with the inflated sense of self-importance, still feverish with jihadist paranoia, still with the coterie of sycophantic nutjobs cheering from the peanut gallery.

It's too bad, really. I had this glimmer of hope that perhaps the conversation would have turned to an examination of the many ways the Dear Leader has betrayed every principle of conservative thought and brought the country to the brink of constitutional irrelevance.

But I see a few posts down the thread Pammie's even making fun of the idea that Abu Goner ought to be investigated for being the most mendacious Attorney General in the history of the nation.

Sigh.

Timur is unwittingly accurate: nothing to see here folks, move along, move along...

[duncan]

You are accusing me of bile? This entire site is nothing but bile...no it is nothing but hatred. Hatred for Arabs. Hatred for Liberals. Hatred for people who oppose the war, even those who have fought in it. Hatred for anyone who does not agree with you. And what exactly does Ms. Atlas expect to accomplish with all of her venomous hatred? Does she honestly think she is changing the world one word at a time? She daily preaches to the members of her very small choir (there can't be more than a dozen who post on this site.) The uninformed who happen upon this site are appalled by the inflamatory, hate-filled rhetoric, and reject the views expressed here. Atlas wonders the streets of New York wondering why people aren't listening. Is she that incapable of understanding that she is not making converts? Unable to see that she is making a hell of a lot more enemies.
Atlas is changing the world one word at at time alright.....she's making it an even uglier place.
lonbud....be warned your post will soon vanish as opposing views are not tolerated here. Like in Stalin's Russia, you will be deemed a non-person

[Gary]

Two lying losers, back to back.

[Timur]

Same loser, different nicks? As for Atlas making the world ugly? Has she cut off anyone's head, videotaped it and put it on the internet? Has she castrated any women in the name of her pseudo-religious cult? Has she used verses from her holy book to justify flying planes into buildings and kill thousands? Did she dance in the streets, joyously fire rifles and pass candy out to kids when the twin towers fell? Has she killed people with car bombs and used her religion to justify it? Has she taken anyone's face off with piano wire? Moslems have done all of the above and you accuse HER of spreading hatred and venom? You two are useful idiots, just the kind the terrorists love. What a pair of freaking morons.

[Rosemary]

Hi Pam. This reminds of the times before we were a country and only a tenth to a third of the people wanted real freedom, while another third wanted to do everything in their power to make us stay under the thumb of the King. Too bad they teach history anymore...

OT: I trackbacked to your great article about the madrassas in NY. This is outrageous. I also added to my new site. I had to move due to this new *stupid* blogger. I hope you like it. ;)

[Rosemary]

Oops! That's supposed to read, "Too bad they DON'T teach history anymore..."

[John D. Infidel]

I feel the same way, Pamela. Just as Nero fiddled as Rome burned so too a majority of Americans diddle as the Jihadists plot.
Yours in Liberty,
John D Infidel

Civilization in the Balance

[Lionheartuk]

A Voice crying in the wilderness..

God bless you Pamela, if it was not for people like you, then the silent majority would not be awakening to the truth.

Your a jewel of this present age.

Lionheart

[John D. Infidel]

Duncan - no hate here but plenty of HATE and bile at the DailyKOS. Think what you will.

[lonbud]

duncan, thanks for the warning, but i had a little run of posting here quite frequently, back when dick cheney was bloviating about dead-enders and last throes in iraq and Pammie's fan club was predicting a Republican sweep in the mid-term elections, so i'm pretty well up to speed with how people think, act, and feel in PamsWorld.

if it's not rosemary remembering what America was like in the eighteenth century, it's Gary thinking every poster who disagrees with Pam's xenophobia is actually the same person posting under different handles.

pretty soon xdhimmi or major doctor doctor will be questioning my courage and my patriotism and begging Pam to ban me from the site.

meanwhile, Iraq is a greater mess and more lethal a place to live than it ever was under saddam (unless you're a kurd), more american boys and girls die in the desert every day, the U.S. Treasury continues to be drained for the benefit of corporate war profiteers, and the Bush administration has made a mockery of constitutional government.

but hey, watch out for that swarthy, bearded young man on the bus - he's probably concealing a razor-sharp scimitar and looking to cut off your head at ANY MOMENT.

[tazzerman2000]

LOL, I'm not sure there IS enough sand on this entire planet for all those like lonbud and duncan to keep sticking there heads into...

Nope, there CERTAINLY isn't a worldwide Jihad going on. Nothing to see there, move along BUT that fucking George Bush (Hitler) Now HE'S the one we really have to look out for.

Got news for you guys, our government was bought and sold a LONG time before Mr Bush took office. A looooooong time before.. AND the Dems had just as much a hand in it as the Repubs...

As far as hatred on this site goes, well... I personally see absolutely no problem hating people who want to kill me and mine. No problem hating people who want to enslave the world in some form of medieval cult worshipping doctrine..

Of course that also goes for socialistic, libertards and morons who continue to stick their heads in the sand and only come up to breath when their BDS senses an opening and/or compels them to spew their complete and udder nonsense... (Check both the DailyKos AND DU sometime) Feel the love?

[Gary]

Guess again, Loonbub. I did NOT claim you and duncan are the same person.

Typical leftist, can't get a single fact straight. Can't even tell what name goes with what post. Next loonbub will be telling us how Bush 43 is just a continuation of his (great?)grandfather's attempts to overthrow FDR.

[Lexecon]

"Looking north on Lex"....that just sounds so NY, and to me, so COOL! OK, sorry about the traffic. My excitement over the street just took over. I am definitely flying up there this fall.

[lonbud]

Geez, Gary, I'd have thought you'd be grateful to have been noticed at all in the light of the fact your posts add nothing to a resonable conversation about what works and what doesn't work in our government and our society.

Anyhoo, sorry to have ID'd you when the honor should have gone to Timur.

And just for the record, the only thing Bush 43 has continued is his own legacy of absolute failure. Isn't it interesting that the man has destroyed every organization with which he's ever been involved? He has an unblemished record of complete and utter ineffectiveness. It's breathtaking, actually.

[The Dave]

Pamela - I just got back to my computer after a couple of days and saw this posting. What a great post!!!

But you're never going to get most people to care the way you do and the way most of your readers do. It's just not going to happen.

Remember the movie The Front Page from the 30s. When they remake page one, they take Hitler off the page but leave the rooster - "that's human interest." People haven't changed.

There was a chance for something different right after 9/11 but Bush blew it. Instead of mobilizing the anger people felt towards the terrorists, he said we should act just like nothing happened or the terrorists would win. Go shopping - go to Disney World.

The military would take care of it. They're good at it but they can't do it without widespread popular support and Bush has lost the chance for that. It's really too bad. We'll all pay for that failure in the future.

Great post.

Dave

[wxjames]

WASHINGTON (AP) - The U.S. military commander in charge of defending the U.S. homeland said Tuesday that he believes there are al-Qaida cells in the United States or people working to create them. And he states we need two new brigades to combat them.

Well, I have an alternate strategy. Why not begin deportation of all Muslims ? Outlaw the practice of Islam and confiscate all korans. Declare Islam a death cult and not a relgion, and raze all the mosques to the ground. The people will help by dragging all the muzzies to the docks kicking and screaming and therefore the cost will be kept to a minimum.
Yes, there will be a few who convert at dockside, and we can accept some of them, but in the end we will be deporting them anyway, so why not start it now ?
We have had time to think about this and those of us who have facts upon which to base conclusions know that Islam and democracy do not mix. President Bush does not know this. He and so many of the elites believe that it is impossible to be hard wired against modern comforts, yet Islam has achieved that in millions of it's 'victims.'
Had we the balls of our forefathers, we would have overrun the ME oil fields and driven the natives into the vast stretches of wasteland. However, we are a tab brainwashed ourselves by political correctness.
Remember, Islam teaches that a good muslim can and will kill any and all non-muslims to spread the control of Islam over all men.
It is an end in itself. There is no day after, so then, they will begin to kill each other until only one remains standing.
It's the catch 22 of humanity, and would be as amusing if we could get past the blood.

[Timur]

"...Iraq is a greater mess and more lethal a place to live than it ever was under saddam (unless you're a kurd), more american boys and girls die in the desert every day..."
What a load of horse crap! America is winning the war in Iraq and Iraqis are dropping dimes on al-queda and reporting the bastards because they are getting sick and tired of being under the thumb of the suicide bombers and terrorists. Look at the mass graves that have been found in Iraq and then tell me about how many people died under Saddam's rule.
Secondly the members of the Armed Forces are not "boys and girls" but MEN and WOMEN who have volunteered to serve their country and fight terrorism. I am sick of the yellow bellied cowards crawling in their own urine who have never had the courage to serve the country that has given them so much but never fail to criticize it at every opportunity and denigrate the contributions of those who have. More Americans die on the highways in the US in one year from alcohol related accidents than have been killed in Iraq, Afghanistan and the Phillipines in over four and a half years of fighting Islamic supremicists.
I thank G-d for people like Pamela who have the intelligence and courage to speak up rather than fall in with the rest of the lobotomized liberal sheep and repeat the party line ad infinitum ad nauseam, like some damned religious mantra.
Given the choice of listening to Pamela or some clownishly grotesque post-menopausal media whore like Cindy Sheehan, guess who I choose to listen to?
I just hope that my daughter grows up to be as strong and intelligent as Ms. Geller.

[lonbud]

Bravo, Timur. Having the courage of one's convictions is a misunderappreciated American virtue.

Couple of things, though:

Daily life for the average Iraqi citizen is far more lethal and toxic today than it was under Saddam. Sure, if you were a Kurd or a mouthy Shi'ite it was a dangerous place to live, but chances were you wouldn't die in a random explosion standing in line at the grocery, the post office, or applying for a job. Thant happens every day now.

Human beings under the age -- depending on the individual -- of between 25, 30, are not, in my experience, men or women. Those between 18 and their early 20s, I would definitely still classify as boys and girls.

Which is by no means to diminish the bravery and sacrifice made by the young people who volunteer to serve their country in the military. I honor and respect and appreciate the commitment of each and every one of them and tell them so to their faces when I see them in airports or as they make their way through my city on their furloughs.

The sad thing is they are forced to take orders from rich, fat, white men "who have never had the courage to serve the country that has given them so much," who send them on impossible missions with inadequate planning and armor, and abandon them on their return to inadequate care and support for their wounds.

The fact that far more people die annually in alcohol-related accidents on the highways (or from culturally-induced heart disease and from insurance-company mandated substandard health care) than from serving Dick Cheney's vision of a democratic Middle East is a non sequitur.

Pamela, like you, deserves kudos for believing in something and for being willing to shout it from the mountaintops.

You are both just off the mark in identifying the source of the threat to our way of life.

[Timur]

Nice try ion. But you show your prejudice and bigotry with the comment about "rich white men". Standard parroting of the party line, like a good little Stalinist. You ignore the advances in this country that allow women like Pelosi and Clinton and men like Obaman to pull the strings. People like you would rather hide behind comments about inadequate armor when in fact there are some things in wars that NO amount of armor will protect you from. A soldier understands that and still goes on to serve his or her country despite the danger because they know that bringing freedom to oppressed people is worth the sacrifice. Regardless of their age that is part of the maturation process that people like you who just stay at home and bitch never fully understand. It is you and the other whiners like you who are childish because you are never willing to consider others who are worse off than you in other countries.
If you've never worn the uniform, never been willing to sacrifice yourself for others, don't pretend that you understand what it's all about.
Yeah Iraqis have it tough. So what? Who doesn't? At least they have a chance to control their own destiny now, something they never had under Saddam. Now they are free to vote or not and there is more than one name on the ballot.
Getting hit by a suicide bomber is no different than getting hit by a drunk driver. Dead is dead. The Israelis have been dealing with those kinds of attacks from by Moslems for years.
At least now Iraqis don't have to worry about being dragged out of their homes in the middle of the night by government police because of something they said the day before and disappearing forever. How long do you think someone like Cindy Sheehan would have lasted under Saddam? I remember an old woman who criticized Saddam publicly because her two sons had died in the Iraq-Iran war and she had no one to take care of her. Saddam shot her in the face.
There are some people who think the kind of freedom to criticize one's government is worth fighting for and even dying for and that all men and women should have it. They are the ones with the courage to stand up and put on the uniforms and G-d bless 'em.
The greatest threat to "our way of life" is from people like you who just don't get it.
Our way of life only exists and we only have the freedoms we do because of those men and women in uniform.

[duncan]

Timur,
I have four members of my immediate family who have served in the military, including one who served in Vietnam and another who served in Iraq. In all my postings on this site I have refrained from name calling. But now I absolutely have to say, only a complete ass would say this.."Getting hit by a suicide bomber is no different than getting hit by a drunk driver." When you start up your car do you always think you are going to get hit by a drink driver? Do you spend 24/7 thinking you may get hit by an IED? You are so damn clueless. It is clear you have never worn the uniform. And it appear that Atlas Shrugs and Fox are your only source of news, because if you did read what daily life was like for your average Iraqi, you would not even dream of saying their lives are better off.
As I finish this I will say that I know full well this post will be eliminated. Atlas has turned into a modern day Stalin in her own little world. She spends her days at demonstrations with camera in hand attempting to intimidate citizens from exercising their rights of assembly and free speech. And she edits out any voice of opposition on her site. I am reminded of the old Walt Kelly comic strip Pogo. "we have met the enemy and it is us." Pamela Stalin Geller.

[lonbud]

Timur, my misguided friend, let us agree at least on this -- the problem is not our soldiers in uniform. You and I both hold them in the highest regard and understand that our freedoms (those that remain, anyhow) are due in large part to the sacrifices made by generations of soldiers like them.

However, my comment about "rich, white men" is no betrayal of prejudice or bigotry on my part, it's simply the truth: GWB, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz, Perle, Rove -- each one of them rich, white, male, and not a single one of them ever in the line of fire.

If "the advances in this country that allow women like Pelosi and Clinton and men like Obama to pull the strings" had actually come into play, we wouldn't be in the mess we're in now. They and a diverse group like them will most surely be left with the thankless task of cleaning up the Bush administration's mess starting in January 2009, but how many of our soldiers and innocent Iraqis will die in the meantime?

Unfortunately, Iraqis do have to worry still about being dragged out of their homes in the middle of the night, and your likening suicide bombers to drunk drivers is simply breathtaking.

Please post a link to the report or the film footage of Saddam shooting the old lady you mention in the face; I'm inclined to believe that is an apocryphal tale supporting the lore of his historical monstrosity. Not that he wasn't a bad dude, but I'd still like some corroboration of that particular crime, if you don't mind.

None of my opinions ought be read, either, as a denial of the threat of Islamic extremism. I believe the threat is real and I believe Islamic extremists are a savage, fanatical problem every peace and freedom-loving person on this earth must acknowledge and confront.

I just believe our leadership has managed the job of doing so very badly these past seven years, and have placed our ability to manage it going forward in grave danger.

[duncan]

lonbud,
My last post, which expressed pretty much the same sentiment you have here, was eliminated. So I will reiterate. The author and readers of this site are incapable of thinking in anything but either/or terms. You either support George Bush and the agenda of his neocons or you support the violent Muslims. When you point out that you support neither, it simply can't compute in their brains. A testament to the successful brainwashing of the Bush administration. "You are either for us or against us."
Just one more thing ...you forgot my favorite neocon of them all. Bill "Go Kill 'Em" Kristol. That's YOU go kill them 'cause I had to sit out Vietnam and my military age kids have to sit this one out too.

[Timur]

"It is clear you have never worn the uniform." FYI I spent over 7 years in a combat MOS in the Army. I wasn't some REMF. You are the one who is clueless. I've got more time in the latrine than you have listening to "war stories".
The comment about the drunk driver is accurate; a sudden unexpected attack while you are going about your normal every day business. I've been hit by a drunk driver and am lucky to be alive. I speak from experience.
I'll try and find the exact source I originally heard that recounting of the woman getting shot by Saddam, but it may take a while as I believe it was either a newspaper, magazine or book. I'll have to go through my sources when I have time. But I won't forget, and I am not making it up. In the meantime here are some other examples of how much "better off" Iraqis were under Saddam.
http://www.dailynews.com/bridgetjohnson/ci_4938800
"There was a woman who was pregnant and about to give birth ... They threw her into the hole and they shot her so many times her stomach got ripped and the baby fell out. This is something I saw with my own eyes - I was there in the same hole."
and here:
http://www.desert-voice.net/saddam_sons.htm

"The methods used by the ruling Baath Party have never been subtle. When the Army briefly drove out the Baathists in the early 1960s, it discovered a chamber of horrors where Saddam worked as an officer. In the cellars of Qasr-al—Nihayyah (“the Palace of the End,” so-called because King Faisal II was murdered there in 1958), the Army found “electric wires with pincers, pointed iron stakes on which prisoners were made to sit, and a machine which still bore traces of chopped-off fingers,” according to one account based on official sources.
Saddam has always believed in the symbolic power of mutilation. “Under torture, the high and mighty are quite literally exposed as being made of the same stuff as everyone else,” writes Kanan Makiya in his study of Saddam’s Iraq, “Republic of Fear.” As Iraqi ruler, Saddam delivered the broken bodies of his victims to their families. He was aiming at the creation of “a new man” in Iraq, just as Hitler and Stalin had tried to do in Nazi Germany and Soviet Russia."
Also from Hussein Kamel al-Majid, Saddam's cousin and son-in-law ina Time interview:
"TIME: Why did you decide to defect? Hussein Kamel: I was motivated by the interests of the country. I reached the point where I found [criticizing erroneous policies] to be futile. For the past 15 years Iraq has not stopped fighting. It has ended up accumulating debts that will require generations and generations to repay. There are too many executions in our society, too many arrests. Whatever the age of the critic--whether 80 or 15--many people are executed. For these reasons I left"
Hussein Kamel was forced to return to Iraq where he was executed by Saddam.
http://www.amnestyusa.org/annualreport.php?id=9021EC5BAE52279880256A0F005BEBAC&c=IRQ
and again:
http://www.state.gov/g/drl/rls/15996.htm
"Iraq under Saddam’s regime has become a land of hopelessness, sadness, and fear. A country where people are ethnically cleansed; prisoners are tortured in more than 300 prisons in Iraq. Rape is systematic . . . congenital malformation, birth defects, infertility, cancer, and various disorders are the results of Saddam’s gassing of his own people. . . the killing and torturing of husbands in front of their wives and children . . . Iraq under Saddam has become a hell and a museum of crimes."
– Safia Al Souhail, Iraqi Citizen, Advocacy Director, International Alliance for Justice

In one cell pieces of human flesh – ear lobes – were nailed to the wall, and blood spattered the ceiling. A large metal fan hung from the ceiling and my guide told me prisoners were attached to the fan and beaten with clubs as they twirled. There were hooks in the ceiling used to suspend victims. A torture victim told me that prisoners were also crucified, nails driven through their hands into the wall. A favorite technique was to hang men from the hooks and attach a heavy weight to their testicles.
– Independent, March 29, 1991 '
Let me know if you need more proof.

Ion, remember it was former President Clinton who signed the executive order calling for Saddam's removal and then did nothing about it. (HR 4655, the "Iraq Liberation Act of 1998.")
Clinton is our "Blue" President; he blew the sax, he blew his chance to get Bin Laden he blew the chance to remove Saddam, and he blew his load over Monica's blue dress. At least Bush served in the military. Clinton ran to England to escape the draft.
G-d help us if Obama or Hillary get into office. Regardless of who is our next president we are going to be in that part of the world for a long time. Look at how long we've been in Germany, Japan and Korea. If you think the Dems or anyone else are going to get us out of there quickly, you're fooling yourself.

[duncan]

Timur,
Once again, you are incapable of understanding that we are not supporters of Saddam Hussein. In fact I was outraged by the Reagan/Bush and later Bush administrations' support of this madman back in the 80's when organizations like Amnesty Int'l were calling Hussein out for his torture...running people through wood chippers live, gassing the Kurds and countless numbers of women raped. Despite all these atrocities, the Reagan and Bush administrations saw fit to send this madman chemicals through our Dept of Agriculture. And they supported him in countless other ways as well. Think back on that friendly handshake between Rumsfeld and Hussein. And do me a favor don't respond to this with that old canard "The enemy of my enemy is my firend." B.S.! The enemey of my enemy will soon become my enemy. (And as Vietnam has taught us , my enemy will soon enough become my friend.)
That I do not support George Bush does not make me a supporter of Hussein. It does not even make me wiling to look the other way from Hussein's actions against his people. The difference between you and me is that I was opposed to him back in the 80's as well, not just after he invaded Kuwait, or when George Jr. decided he was a threat to the U.S. Calling out Hussein for his atrocities twenty years after the fact is a very convenient tactic of neocons who are motivated by the need to protect oil interests.
So, if I was opposed to Hussein how could I possibly say that life is worse in Iraq after his overthrow? I guess I would have to say that total chaos and anarchy which is what exists now is worse than what existed under Hussein. And I will admit to selfishness here. There were no American lives being lost under the Hussein regime. Americans losing their lives for a people who want us to leave.

[duncan]

P.S. Of course we are going to be there for a long time. That, thanks to the failure of the neocons to understand the consequences of their actions. Bush wouldn't even listen to his own father.
Now that the boy wonderless has gotten us bogged down in an impossible situation, he is more than happy to pass the mess along to a Dem administration. And of course his brain, Rove, is already spinning away, creating a narrative that will suggest the Dems were responsible for "losing" the war in Iraq.
By the way, I hear so much from folks like you about "winning the war." I would like to hear from you a definition of what winning the war is. What conditions would constitute victory? Please explain. I am sick of meaningless words.

[Timur]

"...you are incapable of understanding that we are not supporters of Saddam Hussein."
Wrong again. I had (have) A GT of 141. If you were in the military you know what that means.
"...total chaos and anarchy which is what exists now is worse than what existed under Hussein." Wrong again. That is the price for freedom and yeah, war is a motherfucker. But you have never fought, you have never sacrificed, have you? Ever heard the saying "Better to die free than live on your knees?"
As for winning the war consider this: our government is intact Saddam's has been toppled and replaced by a democracy in which the people got to vote, many for the first time ever. Iraq is no longer controlled by the minority Bathist party. People can have personal computers, cell phones and satellite TV, things that were outlawed under Saddam. Women can vote and get educations, potable water and electricity is available in many places where it wasn't before and the standard of living is gradually increasing for the majority of people. Saddam was tried and convicted of his crimes and executed. Strike three, you're out.

[duncan]

Timur,
In your narrow little Fox/Atlas fueled mind I'M out. Consider the following:

As U.S. Rebuilds, Iraq Won’t Act on Finished Work
By JAMES GLANZ
Iraq’s national government is refusing to take possession of thousands of American-financed reconstruction projects, forcing the United States either to hand them over to local Iraqis, who often lack the proper training and resources to keep the projects running, or commit new money to an effort that has already consumed billions of taxpayer dollars.

The conclusions, detailed in a report released Friday by the Special Inspector General for Iraq Reconstruction, a federal oversight agency, include the finding that of 2,797 completed projects costing $5.8 billion, Iraq’s national government had, by the spring of this year, accepted only 435 projects valued at $501 million. Few transfers to Iraqi national government control have taken place since the current Iraqi government, which is frequently criticized for inaction on matters relating to the American intervention, took office in 2006.

The United States often promotes the number of rebuilding projects, like power plants and hospitals, that have been completed in Iraq, citing them as signs of progress in a nation otherwise fraught with violence and political stalemate. But closer examination by the inspector general’s office, headed by Stuart W. Bowen Jr., has found that a number of individual projects are crumbling, abandoned or otherwise inoperative only months after the United States declared that they had been successfully completed. The United States always intended to hand over projects to the Iraqi government when they were completed.

Although Mr. Bowen’s latest report is primarily a financial overview, he said in an interview that it raised serious questions on whether the problems his inspectors had found were much more widespread in the reconstruction program.

The process of transferring projects to Iraq “worked for a while,” Mr. Bowen said. But then the new government took over and installed its finance minister, Bayan Jabr, who has been a continuing center of controversy in his various government posts and is formally in charge of the transfers.

“After Mr. Jabr took over, that process ceased to function,” Mr. Bowen said.

In fact, in the first two quarters of 2007, Mr. Bowen said, his inspectors found significant problems in all but 2 of the 12 projects they examined after the United States declared those projects completed.

In one of the most recent cases, a $90 million project to overhaul two giant turbines at the Dora power plant in Baghdad failed after completion because employees at the plant did not know how to operate the turbines properly and the wrong fuel was used. The additional power is critically needed in Baghdad, where residents often have only a few hours of electricity a day.

Because the Iraqi government will not formally accept projects like the refurbished turbines, the United States is “finding someone at the local level to handle the project, handing them the keys and saying, ‘Operate and maintain it,’ ” another official in the inspector general’s office said.

If the pace of the American rebuilding program is a guide, those problems could quickly accelerate: So far, the United States has declared that $5.8 billion in American taxpayer-financed projects have been completed, but most of the rest of the projects within a $21 billion rebuilding program that Mr. Bowen examined in the report are expected to be finished by the end of this year. Some of that money is also being used to train and equip Iraqi security forces rather than finance construction projects.

The report was released too late in the day to contact Mr. Jabr, who is part of a Shiite alliance in charge of the government. In his previous position as interior minister, he was accused of running Shiite death squads out of the ministry. In his current position he has developed a reputation as being slow to release budget money to Iraqi government entities, which would have to run the new projects at substantial expense.

He is sometimes suspected of seeking to use his position to undermine the government of Prime Minister Nuri Kamal al-Maliki, who is also a Shiite but answers to a different faction within the alliance. In interviews, Mr. Jabr has rejected those accusations and says he strongly supports the government.

American researchers who have followed the reconstruction said Mr. Bowen’s report raised serious new doubts about the program. Rick Barton, co-director of the postconflict reconstruction project at the Center for Strategic and International Studies, a research institute in Washington, said the lack of interest on the part of the Iraqis was the latest demonstration that they were not involved enough in its planning stages. “It sort of confirms that you really need pre-agreement on the projects you are attempting,” Mr. Barton said, “or you end up with these kinds of problems at the tail end, where people don’t know much about the program and they haven’t bought into it.”

Mr. Barton said that the episode was probably inevitable given that the elected Iraqi government operated mainly within the fortified Green Zone in Baghdad and had little capability of managing thousands of new projects around the country. He said that this was the most likely explanation — rather than any ill will on Mr. Jabr’s part. But Mr. Barton said the findings indicated that the United States should put some of the remaining money in the program into “sustainment,” the term for running the projects, rather than continuing to build when there might be no one to run the projects.

“To build something and not have these issues resolved from top to bottom is unfathomable,” said William L. Nash, a retired general who is a senior fellow at the Council on Foreign Relations and an expert on Middle East reconstruction. “The management of the reconstruction program for Iraq has been a near-total disaster from the beginning.”

The report says that of the 2,797 projects declared completed, besides the 435 projects formally accepted by Iraq’s central government, 1,141 have been transferred to local Iraqi authorities. American government entities in charge of those projects include the United States Army Corps of Engineers, the American-led multinational forces in Iraq, the United States Embassy and the United States Agency for International Development. In letters attached to Mr. Bowen’s report, several of those entities largely concurred with many of Mr. Bowen’s findings and said that new agreements were being hammered out with the Iraqi government to smooth the transfers.

A spokesman for the development agency, David Snider, said in a statement that work now being undertaken by the agency “helps address the concerns” raised in the report. Mr. Snider said that the agency was seeking to formalize an agreement with the Iraqi government that would protect the American investment there.

The agency “usually secures these commitments from recipient governments before the initiation of a project,” Mr. Snider said. But in the case of Iraq, he said, the American rebuilding effort “began before the current Iraqi government was established.”

And how about this from the Associated Press?:
A key aide says Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki's relations with U.S. commander Gen. David Petraeus are so poor the Iraqi leader may ask Washington to withdraw the well-regarded U.S. military leader from duty here.

The Iraqi foreign minister calls the relationship "difficult." ... U.S. Ambassador Ryan Crocker, who meets together with al-Maliki and Petraeus at least weekly, concedes "sometimes there are sporty exchanges."

Al-Maliki has spoken sharply -- not of Petraeus or Crocker personally -- but about their tactic of welcoming Sunni militants into the fight against al-Qaida forces in Anbar and Diyalah provinces.

No, I have never fought in war. Have you? You speak of serving 7 years in a combat MOS. Where did you see combat?
I would hope that if faced with an assault on my country and its freedoms, I would fight. I will not, however, support fighting for the neocon agenda of preserving control over oil. That is not what I calll fighting for freedom. I want freedom from oil dependence and dependence on that part of the world.
Finaly I find people who resort to bragging about their IQ' to win an arguement to be such bores.

[HelyeahWinnie]

Dear Timur;

As a citizen of the U.S. I realize that Freedom is NOT free. Thank you and God bless you for your service.

[HelyeahWinnie]

Dear Timur;

As a citizen of the U.S. I realize that Freedom is NOT free. Thank you and God bless you for your service.

[duncan]

HelyeahWinnie,
I agree with you. Freedom is not free. Now what freedoms do you think we are fighting for in Iraq? These are not the people who attacked us on 9/11. The people who attacked us on 9/11 were Saudis. Have you read the paper today?
WASHINGTON — The Bush administration has decided to supply billions of dollars in advanced new weapons to Saudi Arabia and other Arab allies of the United States.

Will you people wake up and realize that this administration is lying through their teeth as they program you to spout meaningless phrases like "We must win in Iraq." "We have to fight them over there or else we will fight them here."
Guess what folks they...Saudis ...attacked us over here and now Bush is going to arm them. Osama bin Laden is a member of the bin Laden family that both H.W and W Bush are so cozy with. Do you know about Bandar Bush? Will you please wake up?

[HelyeahWinnie]

Dear Duncan;

I am wide awake and arming the Saudis makes no sense to me!

Am looking for a Leader to be the next President and haven't found one yet. Do you have any suggestions?

[Timur]

Duncan you insinuated that I was "incapable of understanding" which is a cowardly way of saying that I'm stupid. I am not. (But how elitist of you to say that anyone who responds to your ad homimem attacks is a bore.) You failed to respond to my proof that we have won the war and all that we are doing now is mopping up. Nobody ever said reconstruction was going to be easy. The complete copy and paste job you did just illustrates how little education people received under Saddam and destroys your argument instead of bolstering it as well as showing your inability to confront the facts and respond with a cogent argument of your own. It also shows your bias in that you conveniently ignore the Iraqis who want us there and who are grateful that they have been liberated from a despot. Of course our enemies want us to leave. Yours is a typical pedantic response from a juvenile mind. Using your rationale there were no American lives lost as long as we weren't invading Germany or Japan in WWII. If you're going to quote sources at least try to give the link so you won't be accused of plagiarism. Here is the one you got your "information" from, the "New Duranty" Times.
Typical liberal slanted Bravo Sierra.
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/07/28/world/middleeast/28reconstruct.html?hp
Helyeahwinnie, thanks. Loved every minute of it.